FINALLY! A whole day of Rivet Wars goodness.....
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Thread: FINALLY! A whole day of Rivet Wars goodness.....

  1. #1

    Default FINALLY! A whole day of Rivet Wars goodness.....

    A few of us got together today to play a ton of Rivet Wars for the first time. Three of us were major backers, and we've all been chomping at the bit to get our copies. Today was our Rivet Wars D(ice)-Day.

    Between the five of us and a few copies of the game, we played easily over a dozen games over a few hours. The game is extremely fast-paced and the rules are soooooooo simple. But, as the day went on, we learned how simple rules can subtly interact to be much more than the sum of their parts.

    About 2 hours into our gaming, the whole "Blight Wall" tactic started to rear its ugly head. There was much grumbling about how unstoppable a couple of machine guns and a handful of infantry seem to be. We played on. We switched sides. We played Scenario 2 five consecutive times in an hour, trying to unlock the key to the balance we felt had to be hiding in the rules somewhere. We tried different Allied unit combinations and tactics.

    And then, almost by accident (as often happens while learning a new game)....... The answer was right there all along. Combined arms and using the grid targeting order against your enemy to neutralize his tactics.

    Then the hidden tactics started to fall like rain. Patient movement, in concert, between your infantry and your bikes - backed up with your pounders. Pulling models back from an objective once you have it controlled - positioning yourself for counter attacks. Using the heroes - and countering your opponents' plays with your heroes who are built *perfectly* to do the job (having problems stopping the Wolverine? you have a freakin *sniper* in your arsenal).

    Sure, lucky dice rolls and pulling *just* the right missions/actions can really swing momentum in your favor. But as the day rolled on we found that we were able to much better adapt and counter those offensive pushes and defensive tactics. And this is just with the basic box set. There are so many more units and heroes yet to come, opening up many more tactical options.

    We ended the day with a large 4-player game using two box sets. The game scales up marvelously, as we suspected it might.

    At the end of the day, we reluctantly had to put away the games and go home. We all were a bit nervous that all our excitement for this game would lead to a bit of a letdown. I'm happily reporting Rivet Wars is everything we hoped it would be and, surprisingly, much more.

    Thanks, Ted, for a fantastic game.

  2. #2

  3. #3

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    any advice for 4 player game?

  4. #4

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    We didn't do anything too crazy. Mission 4 is essentially your basic pitched battle. We made a double mission 4 map. Each player draws their own actions and secret missions from one shared team deck. Both players have access to the entire deployment zone but are limited to their own models (ie each player only has 9 infantry, 1 tank, etc). VP's are earned for the team, first team to 20 wins. Turn order went Allied first player, Blight first player, Allied second player, Blight second player.

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    My teammate and I were the Allies, and we deployed our pounders and rocket bikes to cover most of the right half of the map. We made our infantry push up the center and left flank, hoping to overwhelm the strategic objectives. Some fortunate Secret Mission cards and a beastly charge up the left flank by the M2 Wolverine allowed us to win 20-8.
    Last edited by Tauwolf; 01-13-2014 at 05:23 AM.

  5. #5

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    awesome sauce. really stoked to hear the 4 player went smoothly, really looking forward to getting my extra tile set & expansion units for multi player games. We too found one of the best moves is often backwards, pushing forward in waves & falling back to re-group. Also, i can't stop using the parman/wolverine combo to sweep across the battlefield - too much fun.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tauwolf View Post
    About 2 hours into our gaming, the whole "Blight Wall" tactic started to rear its ugly head. There was much grumbling about how unstoppable a couple of machine guns and a handful of infantry seem to be. We played on. We switched sides. We played Scenario 2 five consecutive times in an hour, trying to unlock the key to the balance we felt had to be hiding in the rules somewhere. We tried different Allied unit combinations and tactics.

    And then, almost by accident (as often happens while learning a new game)....... The answer was right there all along. Combined arms and using the grid targeting order against your enemy to neutralize his tactics.
    How does the grid target order prevent the Blight Wall ? If a rocket bike is first, attack with infantry, if infantry is first, attack with machine gun. The grid order doesn't really make a difference for the blight. Especially since you can attack infantry with blight infantry if your really desperate. Grid order is much more effective vs. Allies at the moment.

    Through all my plays I've been completely ignoring rocket bikes most of the time. Only fielding them to take out monowheels that get too close. I deploy both Hammer-65'ers first round and rely on them to try and snipe machine guns or hit grids that grouped up. Seems to work much better than Rocket Bikes trying to get close to the enemy (which they 99% of the time fail to do)

    I abuse the Cavalry Hero too. Activate rapid assault while in a grid with 2 infantry, and move him to another grid with units in it to give them rapid assault 3 too all in the same turn. So that's potentially 4 infantry with rapid assault 3 =p. Using him for the buff is more effective, in my opinion, than actually using him to fight.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by chibi-vampire View Post
    How does the grid target order prevent the Blight Wall ? If a rocket bike is first, attack with infantry, if infantry is first, attack with machine gun. The grid order doesn't really make a difference for the blight. Especially since you can attack infantry with blight infantry if your really desperate. Grid order is much more effective vs. Allies at the moment.

    Through all my plays I've been completely ignoring rocket bikes most of the time. Only fielding them to take out monowheels that get too close. I deploy both Hammer-65'ers first round and rely on them to try and snipe machine guns or hit grids that grouped up. Seems to work much better than Rocket Bikes trying to get close to the enemy (which they 99% of the time fail to do)

    I abuse the Cavalry Hero too. Activate rapid assault while in a grid with 2 infantry, and move him to another grid with units in it to give them rapid assault 3 too all in the same turn. So that's potentially 4 infantry with rapid assault 3 =p. Using him for the buff is more effective, in my opinion, than actually using him to fight.
    You will need to wipe out the blight infantry in two columns with the mortar, then move the rocket bike and infantry up. Means no infantry to attack the bike and your infantry is safe from the machine gun.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by chibi-vampire View Post
    I abuse the Cavalry Hero too. Activate rapid assault while in a grid with 2 infantry, and move him to another grid with units in it to give them rapid assault 3 too all in the same turn. So that's potentially 4 infantry with rapid assault 3 =p. Using him for the buff is more effective, in my opinion, than actually using him to fight.
    now that's sneaky as all get-out. didn't even think about using his buff that way... would be a great way to launch the hammers up the field too... hmmm

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by DnE View Post
    You will need to wipe out the blight infantry in two columns with the mortar, then move the rocket bike and infantry up. Means no infantry to attack the bike and your infantry is safe from the machine gun.
    I guess I'm still not understanding. The 65'ers should never hit more than 1 infantry, 2 if your really lucky. So even if you manage to wipe out the first line, as soon as you move your units up, they will be in range of the 2nd line. The only way your eliminating all the Blight infantry in 1 round is the Blight playing poorly and grouping all his infantry in 1 grid.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by chibi-vampire View Post
    Activate rapid assault while in a grid with 2 infantry, and move him to another grid with units in it to give them rapid assault 3 too all in the same turn. So that's potentially 4 infantry with rapid assault 3 =p. Using him for the buff is more effective, in my opinion, than actually using him to fight.
    Can you do this if the Cav Hero doesn't have a valid target? In other words, can you Rapid Assault just for the move during the combat phase? I was thinking the answer was no.

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by WTFGamer View Post
    Can you do this if the Cav Hero doesn't have a valid target? In other words, can you Rapid Assault just for the move during the combat phase? I was thinking the answer was no.
    Rapid Assault is just a movement. There is no combat or target in the ability. And it must be done before the unit attacks (ie: you can't attack, then rapid assault somewhere)

    Does pose the question of whether or not you can rapid assault between attacks though on units like the Ostrich.
    Last edited by chibi-vampire; 01-13-2014 at 12:43 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WTFGamer View Post
    Can you do this if the Cav Hero doesn't have a valid target? In other words, can you Rapid Assault just for the move during the combat phase? I was thinking the answer was no.
    You can, but then can't move during the move phase, so it makes it kinda moot

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by chibi-vampire View Post
    Rapid Assault is just a movement. There is no combat or target in the ability.
    The rule reads: " When a unit with this ability activates during the Combat Phase, It may perform a move of X movement points before attacking."

    I'm not so certain that "before attacking" bit is optional.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by WTFGamer View Post
    The rule reads: " When a unit with this ability activates during the Combat Phase, It may perform a move of X movement points before attacking."

    I'm not so certain that "before attacking" bit is optional.
    The 'before attacking' is a reference of time, not of an action.

  15. #15

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    I see what you are saying, but it sounds more like the action Dash than Rapidly Assaulting anyone.

  16. #16

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    i'm not referring to the rules atm but can't it simply attack an empty grid, if it's mandatory?

  17. #17

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    Rapid Assault requires you to attack.

    To start, it wouldn't be called Rapid Assault if there was no attacking. Second, you are in the combat phase, and if it was only a move, then there would be no point in doing it as you have the movement phase after, and can't move during the movement phase after rapid assaulting, thus making it moot. Therefore, there would be no point to "Rapid Assault" if you aren't attacking. Third, if the Rapid Assault movement was more than the regular movement, nothing would stop people from constantly using that instead of movement. This works vice versa as well unless it was an "option" to attack, but that would make things far overpowered in the Blight's favor.

    Also, this was answered on the kickstarter page...so yeah.

    Endragor: No.
    Last edited by knatebaker; 01-13-2014 at 02:40 PM. Reason: Corrections.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chibi-vampire View Post
    I guess I'm still not understanding. The 65'ers should never hit more than 1 infantry, 2 if your really lucky. So even if you manage to wipe out the first line, as soon as you move your units up, they will be in range of the 2nd line. The only way your eliminating all the Blight infantry in 1 round is the Blight playing poorly and grouping all his infantry in 1 grid.
    So the blight idea is they can control place a machine gun (anti infantry) and control 3 spaces ahead with their infantry a space in front protecting 2 spaces from medium armour.

    The purpose of the 65'ers is to have one per unit you want to wipe out(with their range of 4), preferably the infantry. Note that deploying on your turn can give you the extra firepower needed.

    Once one type of unit (infantry or machine gun) is destroyed, you can move a block of troops and bike forward where only one type of their unit has range and arranging in the correct order so that the remaining blight unit cannot damage them.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by knatebaker View Post
    Rapid Assault requires you to attack.

    To start, it wouldn't be called Rapid Assault if there was no attacking. Second, you are in the combat phase, and if it was only a move, then there would be no point in doing it as you have the movement phase after, and can't move during the movement phase after rapid assaulting, thus making it moot. Therefore, there would be no point to "Rapid Assault" if you aren't attacking. Third, if the Rapid Assault movement was more than the regular movement, nothing would stop people from constantly using that instead of movement. This works vice versa as well unless it was an "option" to attack, but that would make things far overpowered in the Blight's favor.

    Also, this was answered on the kickstarter page...so yeah.

    Endragor: No.
    Not to be mean, but everything you said is just conjecture and completely irrelevant. And I didn't see any quote from ted or cmon about rapid assault on the Kickstarter.

    And you could very well attack an empty grid, as you target grids and not units. (ie: gassing an empty grid in the hopes it moves onto the enemy)

    I see WTFGamers's position, and I see my position. And honestly nothing short of an official answer is going to solve this debate.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by DnE View Post
    So the blight idea is they can control place a machine gun (anti infantry) and control 3 spaces ahead with their infantry a space in front protecting 2 spaces from medium armour.

    The purpose of the 65'ers is to have one per unit you want to wipe out(with their range of 4), preferably the infantry. Note that deploying on your turn can give you the extra firepower needed.

    Once one type of unit (infantry or machine gun) is destroyed, you can move a block of troops and bike forward where only one type of their unit has range and arranging in the correct order so that the remaining blight unit cannot damage them.
    I have never experienced this situation. Moving forward at all should always put you in range of both infantry and the MG-08's. The MG-08's should be able to hit 1 row in front of the objectives, and should never move forward after that. The infantry with a range of 2 should be spread out on the objective row and the row behind it. Never more than 1 per square. (Monowheels zoom to wherever)

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