We have the minis would a skirmish game work???
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Thread: We have the minis would a skirmish game work???

  1. #1

    Default We have the minis would a skirmish game work???

    Hi all

    I often think about a skirmish version of ice and fire based around the stat cards we already have for the factions like a kill team type version as we already have the models for it your thoughts ???

  2. #2

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    Honestly with how the Nights Watch and Free Folk are described to have fought, I would have preferred those 2 factions to serve as the basis for an ASOIAF skirmish game and not in a regiment combat game. Skirmish rules could be neat to experiment with.

  3. #3

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    I play a skirmish game with my faction anyway, haven't played any of the objectives or points games in the Rulebook...just play until last man standing wins..

  4. #4

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    Cool how did it work points wise and how many minis were on the table play area size etc?

  5. #5

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    There's no telling what they'll do once the game will be fleshed out. Perhaps they'll even produce a joust format game for tournaments.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oakwolf View Post
    There's no telling what they'll do once the game will be fleshed out. Perhaps they'll even produce a joust format game for tournaments.
    As fun as that would be, I think the game is pretty much as fleshed out as it's going to be (new units and factions notwithstanding)

    I've played a few games of Frostgrave using ASOIAF minis which was pretty fun.

    Alternatively, ASOIAF already kinda is a skirmish game - you're moving around trays of models instead of individuals, but mechanically it's not that different.
    Instead of using trays, you could play the exact same game with a single model, and keep track of how many wounds they have left (everyone starts with 12) - this would then determine how many attack dice they roll etc, exactly like in regular ASOIAF

  7. #7

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    GW's strategy battle game from lotr is probably the closest you could get to use those miniatures in a "non-tray" style game. Then again, GW's War of the Ring (now long gone) was extremely similar to Song of ice and fire.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wakeangel View Post
    Cool how did it work points wise and how many minis were on the table play area size etc?
    1v1 Skirmish Last Man Standing we usually play a 50 point game, last game I played I had 3 Units of Wardens, 1 unit of Sentinels, and 1 unit of Bolton Flayed Men, with commands and attachments and NCU's thats 54 models on the field..

    Last night I played in a 3way 40 Point Skirmish game, great fun, Free Folk vs Neutrals vs Baratheon/Boltons, well over 150 models on the table, and some great tactical play, wasnt a run for the middle and bash each other type of game, was quite strategic despite having that many models on a 6x4 table..

    Baratheon/Bolton combo was last man standing..

    My army was;

    Renley in a unit of Sentinels
    Stag Knights
    2 x Bolton Flayed Men

  9. #9

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    The units in ASoIaF lend themselves wonderfully to Osprey's Dragon Rampant system. A very generic fantasy system.
    The objective of the game is to win. The point of the game is to have fun. The two should never be confused.

  10. #10

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    Ok will check that out thanks

  11. #11

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    I'm sure you can come up with rules that could work, but I think the niche that ASOIAF fills is in the large, abstract nature of it. Representing large armies without needing an excessive number of minis, AND representing that politics off the field directly impacts battles is where I think the genius of the game is.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by DevlinBrightblade View Post
    1v1 Skirmish Last Man Standing we usually play a 50 point game, last game I played I had 3 Units of Wardens, 1 unit of Sentinels, and 1 unit of Bolton Flayed Men, with commands and attachments and NCU's thats 54 models on the field..

    Last night I played in a 3way 40 Point Skirmish game, great fun, Free Folk vs Neutrals vs Baratheon/Boltons, well over 150 models on the table, and some great tactical play, wasnt a run for the middle and bash each other type of game, was quite strategic despite having that many models on a 6x4 table..

    Baratheon/Bolton combo was last man standing..

    My army was;

    Renley in a unit of Sentinels
    Stag Knights
    2 x Bolton Flayed Men
    See this confuses me because this isn't a skirmish game. Its aos level. Skirmish to me means maybe 20 models per side as a kind of max. I think models work great but there are a ton of no tray fantasy games out there. The one piece missing is skirmish games are typically better and more successful when the armies are different with a lot near unique rules. Asoiaf outside of charecters wouldnsteyggle a little with that.
    I agree that NW and FF should have been skirmish game only. They just dont work as massed armies bases on the novel's and ruin any chance for a real war if the 5 kings campaign. they just never should fight anyone but themselves.

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thaumatology View Post
    I'm sure you can come up with rules that could work, but I think the niche that ASOIAF fills is in the large, abstract nature of it. Representing large armies without needing an excessive number of minis, AND representing that politics off the field directly impacts battles is where I think the genius of the game is.
    Yeah, I fully agree. Everyone I've introduced this game to has said the same thing: That the tactics card/board mechanics are the most interesting features of the system. There are a lot of fantasy games out there, but how many can represent battles at this scale, and the political intrigue behind them, with the same level of elegance and accessibility? I guess we're both wondering why one would want to turn it into a skirmish game, when the system is already pulling off this larger scale with a kind of abstracted grace.

    That being said, it's totally doable. I'll echo what Oakwolf said, and recommend the OP look into the Middle Earth SBG rules. Specifically in combination with the Battle Companies supplement. There are enough troops represented in that line that you should be able to find unit profiles that match up pretty well with whatever ASOIAF models you intend to play with. So Wildlings could easily use the rules for wildmen of dunland or Haradrim. Nights watch could use the rules for gondorian rangers or dunedain or something. So you could arrange for the wildlings to have higher courage but lower defense and fight skill and cheaper in points too. Then with the battle company, you would name each guy in your band, and as they fight battles and stuff can gain skills and wargear. There are enough units in the CMON range that you could probably swap a model out with another once it gets enough upgrades. I imagine the whole thing would work quite well.

    Even so, playing both games, I think ASOIAF is just a cleaner game system. It has more parameters and restrictions like a board game while using a lot more abstracted mechanics to keep the rulebook thinner and the game moving faster. Thats why I recommend battle companies specifically in this case. Just my 2 cents.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lion=Heroes View Post
    I agree that NW and FF should have been skirmish game only. They just dont work as massed armies bases on the novel's and ruin any chance for a real war if the 5 kings campaign. they just never should fight anyone but themselves.
    Yeah thematically, the Nights Watch shouldn't really be out fighting pitched battles against the various houses of Westeros. They never seemed to have the numbers for that in any case. However, there are probably hypothetical scenarios the players could come up with to justify (albeit loosely) why the NW and whoever are fighting each other in game. Perhaps the Nights Watch have a new high profile member deemed too dangerous by the opposing faction to be left alive, even though they took the black. So they come in force demanding that person be handed over, and the NW refuses. Or perhaps that force believes the Nights Watch betrayed the realm by sheltering/aiding the FF, and is now demanding its dissolution at the point of a sword. Idk, you could rationalize it somewhat, so it doesn't bother me. I mean Boltons units are showing up in everyone's army, and that actually annoys me more than NW taking the field. They did switch sides, but were never a fractured force of "neutral" mercenaries. I still hold they should be their own faction at this point, their units unavailable to other factions. But it's kind of too late for that now since everyone's been buying Bolton stuff. Wouldn't really be right to say "you can't use those anymore."

    As for the FF, I have no issue with them being a playable army at all. If they're playing the NW, then that's a pretty thematic match-up. If they're not playing the NW, then perhaps assume the NW failed to defend the wall, and was destroyed, disbanded, or retreated from Castle Black. Mance's army is now on the loose south of the wall, and [insert house(s)] has formed an army to stop them.

    My only issue with these two factions is that they were released before the Baratheons and Greyjoys. The intro page in the rulebook sets the stage for the war of 5 kings, so I figured they would work their way through those 5 kings/factions before hitting the factions on the fringes of/outside of that conflict. I find it hard to believe NW, FF, and Targaryens were released before Greyjoys. Speaking of, I think the Greyjoys are the ones who work the least as massed armies. They may be the most skirmishy of all. I don't recall them ever really fighting as anything other than raiders. But they're one of the great houses, and Balon is one of the five kings, so it has to be done. And I bet the models and rules will be really cool too.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lion=Heroes View Post
    See this confuses me because this isn't a skirmish game. Its aos level. Skirmish to me means maybe 20 models per side as a kind of max. I think models work great but there are a ton of no tray fantasy games out there. The one piece missing is skirmish games are typically better and more successful when the armies are different with a lot near unique rules. Asoiaf outside of charecters wouldnsteyggle a little with that.
    I agree that NW and FF should have been skirmish game only. They just dont work as massed armies bases on the novel's and ruin any chance for a real war if the 5 kings campaign. they just never should fight anyone but themselves.
    Oddly enough, even tho the aesthetic is that of a massed battle game, ASOIAF plays very much like a skirmish game with movement restrictions. It's alternating activation where each unit is basically a model, and each player plays with 6-10 models (including NCUs)

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lion=Heroes View Post
    I agree that NW and FF should have been skirmish game only. They just dont work as massed armies bases on the novel's and ruin any chance for a real war if the 5 kings campaign. they just never should fight anyone but themselves.
    What I find interesting about this is don't they though? Jon Snow is bringing the NW and FF into the larger struggle? To a certain extent, this game is a What If? scenario. I mean, you can play Eddard Stark as a Commander. The idea that the FF and NW can't be politicized seems contradicted.

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