So are Starks going to get nerfed?
Results 1 to 14 of 14

Thread: So are Starks going to get nerfed?

  1. #1

    Default So are Starks going to get nerfed?

    They seem quite OP at the moment, and the last big tournament before the pandemic hit was overwhelmingly tilted towards Starks.

  2. #2

    Default

    Which tournament was this? If it was just after the new updates, it could also be explained by a lot of players going back to their older Stark armies to try out the newly buffed units.

    Regardless of whether or not they need it, I doubt CMON has any plans to nerf Starks this year - their commentary alongside the latest update indicated that they consider Starks and Lannisters more or less settled.

  3. #3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AutumnLeaves View Post
    Which tournament was this? If it was just after the new updates, it could also be explained by a lot of players going back to their older Stark armies to try out the newly buffed units.

    Regardless of whether or not they need it, I doubt CMON has any plans to nerf Starks this year - their commentary alongside the latest update indicated that they consider Starks and Lannisters more or less settled.
    My understanding was that the last big Euro tournament had 6/10 of the top 10 being Stark, 5 of those being lists abusing cheap Wolves to get more activations, and there was only 1 Lannister in the top 20. If they consider Starks and Lannisters settled it means they aren't trying to balance them, but rather make Starks overpowered.

  4. #4

    Default

    From my games against Starks, they don't seem dramatically overpowered compared to other factions.
    Certainly they're better than Targaryens, but Targaryens are new, and I think some of their units are a bit underpowered, rather than Stark stuff being strictly OP.

    Wolves are part of Stark's core design - it's not abusing them, any more than FF taking a bunch of Raiders is "abusing" raiders.

    One tournament does not make a pattern. Maybe if they were dominating everything I'd agree with you, but from my experience Starks seem generally fine. Perhaps a little better-than-average, but not enough to really matter.

  5. #5

    Default

    No, Starks are not going to “get nerfed.” There’s no factual basis out there to support the opinion that they or any other faction is OP right now.

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hecaton View Post
    My understanding was that the last big Euro tournament had 6/10 of the top 10 being Stark, 5 of those being lists abusing cheap Wolves to get more activations, and there was only 1 Lannister in the top 20. If they consider Starks and Lannisters settled it means they aren't trying to balance them, but rather make Starks overpowered.

    If you're trying to dictate balance based on results from one event, and basing it on a performance curve, then Starks made up 40% of the total entries across all armies, and while they showed up at the top, they also comprised the lowest section at the bottom of the tournament results, also based on that same fact of being the most played faction.

    Statistically, using the same logic, Neutrals out-curved every single other army by a not-even-close margin... since 50% of all Neutral armies made made it into the top 15% of the tournament... There were 4 total Neutral players...

    This also grossly ignores that, outside the top 6 results, due to pairings, almost all other "placements" in the top 25 were tied for points in the end.

  7. #7

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Alliser Thorne View Post
    If you're trying to dictate balance based on results from one event, and basing it on a performance curve, then Starks made up 40% of the total entries across all armies, and while they showed up at the top, they also comprised the lowest section at the bottom of the tournament results, also based on that same fact of being the most played faction.

    Statistically, using the same logic, Neutrals out-curved every single other army by a not-even-close margin... since 50% of all Neutral armies made made it into the top 15% of the tournament... There were 4 total Neutral players...

    This also grossly ignores that, outside the top 6 results, due to pairings, almost all other "placements" in the top 25 were tied for points in the end.
    If you understood statistics, you'd also know that smaller groups lead to more variance, and so your comment about neutrals is meaningless.

    The real question is, does Starks w/ max wolves overperform, and if so, how much? I think it does, and I think there's a lot of Stark players who desperately don't want to talk about it.

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hecaton View Post
    If you understood statistics, you'd also know that smaller groups lead to more variance, and so your comment about neutrals is meaningless.
    A single tournament result is a pretty small sample group, too.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hecaton View Post
    The real question is, does Starks w/ max wolves overperform, and if so, how much? I think it does, and I think there's a lot of Stark players who desperately don't want to talk about it.
    I don't play Starks, and I'm fairly certain Allister doesn't either. You've hit on the point of this thread though - you think Starks w/max wolves overperform. Unfortunately, there's not really good data backing up this assumption.

    If it ends up being true, and we see more solid evidence that Starks are dominating events, then it's reasonable to assume CMON will step in and nerf Starks. They've done so in the past (see; Cave Dwellers, Great Axes, etc)
    For now though, it doesn't seem to be the case from where I'm standing. More likely, there were just more good players who happened to be playing Starks at that event.

  9. #9

    Default

    If we assume that all factions is idealy balanced - Starks and Lannisters will often be in top as more ppls have them.

  10. #10

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hecaton View Post
    If you understood statistics, you'd also know that smaller groups lead to more variance, and so your comment about neutrals is meaningless.
    That's his point

  11. #11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Valenae View Post
    If we assume that all factions is idealy balanced - Starks and Lannisters will often be in top as more ppls have them.
    The tournament in question was slanted heavily towards Lannister.

    Quote Originally Posted by Codfather View Post
    That's his point
    No, I don't think he (or you) are following. I'd imagine that if there were more tournament results you'd still say the sample size was too low. Wolves are too good in terms of the activation advantage they provide, Sworn Swords and the Sworn Sword Captain are both too good.

  12. #12

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hecaton View Post
    My understanding was that the last big Euro tournament had 6/10 of the top 10 being Stark, 5 of those being lists abusing cheap Wolves to get more activations, and there was only 1 Lannister in the top 20. If they consider Starks and Lannisters settled it means they aren't trying to balance them, but rather make Starks overpowered.
    Hello, where can I find the army lists of this tournament please? Can't find them on the internet

  13. #13

  14. #14

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by -Ekko- View Post
    Hello, where can I find the army lists of this tournament please? Can't find them on the internet

    https://asoiaf-stats.com/tournaments

    Find the NRG tournament then go to player standing

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Privacy Policy  |   Terms and Conditions  |   Contact Us  |   The Legion


Copyright © 2001-2018 CMON Inc.

-->