Painting more realistically
- Thread starter Aliengod3
- Start date
ScottRadom
Shogun of Saskatchewan
I\'m sure you can do this with any paint, but I found that when I switched from GW to Vallejo model color the more realistic tones and shades of that range helped with a more realistic (I\'m reading that term as dirtier and grittier then you currently paint. Is that correct?) finish to my stuff.
My first and foremost reccomendation is, why change? Your painting is slick now and the style is great. Why change? If it\'s a personal motivation then fine but other wise why conform to an entirely different style all of a sudden?
My first and foremost reccomendation is, why change? Your painting is slick now and the style is great. Why change? If it\'s a personal motivation then fine but other wise why conform to an entirely different style all of a sudden?
QuietiManes
New member
I think the main difference with what is generally done with mini\'s and the more realistic stuff, like historicals, is lower contrast, more dirt and grime, smoother and subtler blends. That sort of thing.
Not going quite as extreme with the shades and highlights, not trying to make your NMM look right from multiple angles, not abusing lighting and poses and the scale consistency of the model to suit what \"looks\" good (colour contrast and extra big hands and weapons and that sort of thing), not creating \"focus points\" artificially (painting the face lighter as an example).
Generally just toning everything down and using more \"earthly\" muted colours. VMC has a lot of these types of paints, as mentioned above, VGC and GW on the other hand, not so much, GW did add a few recently though. Not that anyone needs to buy new paints to paint more realistic, just might need to mix up some more neutral colours to use.
Realistic does\'t photograph or display well online, so that\'s why we don\'t see much of it. I think.
Not going quite as extreme with the shades and highlights, not trying to make your NMM look right from multiple angles, not abusing lighting and poses and the scale consistency of the model to suit what \"looks\" good (colour contrast and extra big hands and weapons and that sort of thing), not creating \"focus points\" artificially (painting the face lighter as an example).
Generally just toning everything down and using more \"earthly\" muted colours. VMC has a lot of these types of paints, as mentioned above, VGC and GW on the other hand, not so much, GW did add a few recently though. Not that anyone needs to buy new paints to paint more realistic, just might need to mix up some more neutral colours to use.
Realistic does\'t photograph or display well online, so that\'s why we don\'t see much of it. I think.
Shawn R. L.
New member
In \'real\' life, colors are a lot duller. Very seldom do you have a true saturated color.
It\'s mostly about the colours you use. You can still have a lot of contrast. My latest mini, the Darksword sorceress, has very extreme zenithal lighting and thus, a lot of contrast (it doesn\'t show to full effect in my photos, though).
I very rarely use black and white when I paint, especially white. I almost never highlight using white (unless I\'m painting white). For some colours I shade with black, but for the most part I use dark browns or greys instead. For highlighting, my mostly used colours are VMC Ivory and VMC Flat Flesh.
Also, I think you have to switch to metallics if you want to get away from the comic book style.
I very rarely use black and white when I paint, especially white. I almost never highlight using white (unless I\'m painting white). For some colours I shade with black, but for the most part I use dark browns or greys instead. For highlighting, my mostly used colours are VMC Ivory and VMC Flat Flesh.
Also, I think you have to switch to metallics if you want to get away from the comic book style.
GriffinPainting
New member
Which painters would you recommend to look at as good examples of realistic? I tend to view military/armour sites more than here, because I am most interested in naturalistic, but I\'m sure there must be some in here somewhere? Any recommended painters please?
Pretty much agreeing with what the others have been saying about the colour, many of the mini\'s that have that \'realistic\' style are often painted in subtle tones, like Ritual said browns and greys are used. I know when I myself have been painting black cloth I have been mixing in flesh colours to highlight.
I wouldnt say that the highlighting and shading is any less extreme than if you were painting \'old skool\' or comic book, its just the transitions are a lot less noticeable and that comes from more layers of very subtle colour changes. Really the darkest and brightest colour will be the same its just the blend has to be perfect.
Another key area I think is the visualization of the model, like look a lot at material that could aide the style of painting.
Also i dont necessarily think you have to use true metals if you want to paint gritty, but if NMM is used it will have to perfect, like automaton has very realistic looking NMM.
Also imo the realistic style is what is \'in\' at the moment and as much as i love to see mini\'s painted like this, seeing other styles is great too. I look forward to seeing how you paint this style
I wouldnt say that the highlighting and shading is any less extreme than if you were painting \'old skool\' or comic book, its just the transitions are a lot less noticeable and that comes from more layers of very subtle colour changes. Really the darkest and brightest colour will be the same its just the blend has to be perfect.
Another key area I think is the visualization of the model, like look a lot at material that could aide the style of painting.
Also i dont necessarily think you have to use true metals if you want to paint gritty, but if NMM is used it will have to perfect, like automaton has very realistic looking NMM.
Also imo the realistic style is what is \'in\' at the moment and as much as i love to see mini\'s painted like this, seeing other styles is great too. I look forward to seeing how you paint this style
I would like to point out that \"realistic\" is not the same as \"gritty\". You can paint neatly and cleanly and still get a more life-like look. You don\'t need mud and battle-damage for something to look \"real\". And also, mud and scratches doesn\'t necessarily make something look \"real\" either. If there\'s something that\'s a bit of a trendy thing right now, it\'s the dirty, damaged look, rather than \"life-like\".
I am sure you can do something that looks life like and still use NMM, but still... in general nothing screams \"comic book\" or \"graphic novel\" to me more than NMM.
Another thing I thought of that I think is important... The base and surroundings need to harmonise with the miniature. The mini and the surroundings must have the same general style and atmosphere.
I am sure you can do something that looks life like and still use NMM, but still... in general nothing screams \"comic book\" or \"graphic novel\" to me more than NMM.
Another thing I thought of that I think is important... The base and surroundings need to harmonise with the miniature. The mini and the surroundings must have the same general style and atmosphere.
Shawn R. L.
New member
Agreed here. Especially with black. Black CAN be used very effectively but if you haven\'t painted much it can be an easy way to shade but it also can be a less effective way. One thing I like to do is to simply put the tube of black away and do as much as I can with using colors to do the shading, THEN use black for some really deep areas, but still using it sparingly. What I will do up to that point instead of black is to use Prussian Blue and Burnt Umber mixed together. Basically any brown and blue will give you something more or less in the neutral zone, I have just found these two to make the darkest. What I really like about using this method is that it will usually have JUST A TOUCH of color in the warm or cool direction which adds subtle quality and interest. Frequently in the real world black has a tinge of color.
Burnt Umber
Prussian Blue
Aliengod3
Active member
http://www.coolminiornot.com/140887
Although I would not consider this painting to be realistic (I do not know too many knights with blue hair) it is what am I would like to be able to achieve. More dramatic lighting I guess.
I find that when I lay down my base coat, usually the mid tone, once I have highlighted and shaded I noticed that my colors do not deviate too much from the original base coat. Alot of the base coat ends up showing on my minis once the highlighting and shading is completed.
Although I would not consider this painting to be realistic (I do not know too many knights with blue hair) it is what am I would like to be able to achieve. More dramatic lighting I guess.
I find that when I lay down my base coat, usually the mid tone, once I have highlighted and shaded I noticed that my colors do not deviate too much from the original base coat. Alot of the base coat ends up showing on my minis once the highlighting and shading is completed.
generulpoleaxe
New member
The lighting is directional (zenithal is from above)
try strating with a mid tone, that way you cut out the problem of your darkest colour being the more dominant shade/tone.
tooshy
Active member
The fact that you actually know some Knights is kinda cool.....
But on a more helpful note. In my eyes, the knights hair on this model isn\'t blue - it has blue tones which give his hair a more realistic colour (IMO) rather than just boring grey/brown/ or black hair.
I know you don\'t want to change your painting style - and you shouldn\'t have to - but maybe you need to change the way your look at or interpret colours. It\'s something I did a while ago and it\'s kinda cool. Just take a bit of time to look around you. Is the grass only green or the sky only blue. You\'d probably be surprised as to how many colours are mixed in.
Anders is spot on with his colours: use greys and browns etc for shading; I always use orange and flesh tones for highlighting red for example and ivory isn\'t so harsh as using white to lighten a colour.
Then there is the use of complimentary colours: using green to shade red (but only a touch) or blue to shade yellow. Try it! You\'ll get some great results
Good luck and I look forward to seeing how you apply any advice you\'ve gained.
EDIT: Hey I just had a look at your pics. You have a great painting style!! Having seen your Trollblood Axer (ace by the way) it made me think of Fluffly\'s version. Not sure if you\'ve seen it, but if you go and have a look (it\'s on the Privateer Press site or her gallery) you will see how she did her skin tones. There are hues of purple and red all mixed in with the blues and greys which is what makes the skin on that model really pop. Your Axer is excellent, as I said, but lacks the \'oooh\' factor for the skin. I\'m being unfair really, cos we all wish we could paint like Fluffy - but her use of shadows and highlights are something else! Cheers T
Aliengod3
Active member
The thought of experimenting scares the hell out of me because I do not want to screw up my minis but I guess I have to. Thanks for the help everyone. I will try to post some pics of the minis I am working on to get some advice about adding colors to certain areas and how to go about it.
Einion
New member
I know you\'ve already given an example but without knowing the style(s) you\'d like to aim for it\'s difficult to give much more than generalities. Those generalities are good advice as far as they go but if you take six historical modellers who work \"realistically\" they could easily produce work almost completely unlike! Their pieces could be so unlike each other that there\'s almost no common areas to the paintwork.
You do have to practice and that means a certain amount of experimentation. It shouldn\'t scare you too much, it\'s not like you can\'t strip a mini and start again.
If it helps: work on development exercises deliberately with the thought that you\'ll strip when you\'re done; that way if you end up with something you think is worth keeping you\'re ahead of the game.
The basics of a more realistic style mostly come down to colour that\'s more like real life - duller colour generally + the right type of colouring from highlight to shadow (usually the same hue or near to it) - and on top of that more directional lighting, plus weathering of various kinds.
Not absolutely necessary but often used as well is careful control of the finish - gloss, satin/semi-matt and matt used appropriately for different materials. IMO you should only go for all-matt if you use a technique like NMM, never for a standard realistic effect.
In addition to all the of the above I think it\'s a good idea to concentrate on historical figures or fantasy minis sculpted in a more realistic style - cartoony sculpts often looks best when painted that way, ditto the reverse.
The hair is blue-grey (at least in the photos)... however since it\'s not painted as a historical piece but as a fantasy figure then why not?
And boring or not hair is usually brown, black or grey
Einion
Ahem Bonde?Originally posted by Einion
And boring or not hair is usually brown, black or grey
Einion
And what about Ginger/Auburn?
My wife might have had something to say about the latter had she not gone all snowy.
Aliengod3
Active member
http://www.coolminiornot.com/167804
Results like this would be nice to achieve. Mathieul is quite the painter and uses color very well. I was told by someone that learned to paint from him that he uses lots of glazes and whatnot to achieve is blending, yet another area I have trouble with. I need to work on blending, colors, and glazes I guess.
Results like this would be nice to achieve. Mathieul is quite the painter and uses color very well. I was told by someone that learned to paint from him that he uses lots of glazes and whatnot to achieve is blending, yet another area I have trouble with. I need to work on blending, colors, and glazes I guess.
