Being disqualified from Golden Demon - what can you do and what can\'t you?

[StarFyre]

Hello,

I know the rules indicate you can be disqualified for obvious breaking of rules.

My question is on the content. We occasionally hear of people being disqualified due to the model not fitting in with the Warhammer mythos.

My question is, I have seen models such as the Kroot that was obviously modified to be the Predator (the mouth was modified and opened up, and resculpted to be the Predator), and the games themselves, have a lot taken from movies (aliens, terminator), and games (D&D) and Tolkien. All of which, has taken most from mythology/world religions...

From this, i have been thinking of something I want to do, but it\'s NOT for Warhammer, and the design is based on artwork for D&D.

Would a model be disqualified if someone recognized it, as a demon from another game, etc? even if the model itself was modified via GW parts of a full sculpt?

ie. if someone sculpted a balor (D&D), and used it instead of the bloodthirster (which is the WH version of the balor), both of which trace back to the Balrog from Tolkien, which traces back to a mythological demon of a similar name, etc.

Would something like that be disqualified if the artwork the balor/bloodthirster was based on was obviously (if someone recognized it) from another game source?

I will start my project and was wondering if I am happy with it, would there be a point of entering it in a GD somewhere.

I doubt I will travel for more generic competitions ever (gencon, or the european competitions) and probably wouldn\'t be any point yet until I improve (cost associated would not justify it right now).

What are people\'s opinions?

Sanjay

 

[matty1001]

as far as I know, a sculpt has to be based on GW\'s artwork or recognisable to the background.

If its based on D&D artwork then I would only assume, no, its not allowed, wither that or you will be treading a fine line.

 

[Ritual]

Using artwork from other games is most likely a no-no unless, of course, the artwork is so generic that it easily fit the GW universe and the sculpt can\'t be easily recognised as being inspired by said artwork. I would go for something else.

 

[Rodnik]

It sounds like you may be over-thinking it a bit.

First off----don\'t violate any license/copyright/etc. Generally, if you create a \"new\" work, you\'re in no danger of this--even if you receive \'inspiration\' from someone else\'s 2d art. Just don\'t blatantly copy someone else\'s stuff and try to pass it off as your own.---like Ritual alluded to.

Second----The model needs to feasibly fit in the worlds created by GW for the particular category you\'re entering.

Scratch builts are acceptable, as are GW models, or conversions to GW models. At last count, you couldn\'t modify the warhammer stuff with LOTR stuff and vice-versa for licensing reasons. I guess that still sticks, but it could have changed.

If you sculpt a demon----then just call it a demon from the GW worlds. It\'s not a Balor, Balrog, etc. It\'s a demon you created based on your understanding of demonology as it relates to the GW worlds---and then name it accordingly. It really doesn\'t matter that you were inspired by Elmore, Caldwell, Brom, etc...

Kev

 

[generulpoleaxe]

it also depends on what gd you enter, as some are more relaxed than others on this sort of thing.

 

[Evil Dave]

Deamons are different in appearance. One of the GW novels I was reading had some Khornate deamons with greyish skin and clockwork parts, nothing we\'ve ever seen in the models.

Think about it, all deamons under a Chaos god looking exactly the same?
Not very Chaotic is it?

Although they are fickle, they did disqualify that Word Bearers Deamon Prince that used banners very similar to Christian Iconory, even though it fit the Word Bearers fluff.

 

[vincenti]

BE CAREFUL

A General Rule of THUMB,. if its not I.P.(Identifiable product) of G.W. Dont bother ,they wont even give it a second look, no matter how brilliant it is.
Strange but True ???

GOD bless ...............VINCENTI

 

[tide of khorne]

Although they are fickle, they did disqualify that Word Bearers Deamon Prince that used banners very similar to Christian Iconory, even though it fit the Word Bearers fluff.

Do you mean golgotha(wich is also a religious name)?

 

[StarFyre]

well...

I was thinking of doing one or 2 of the demon princes or princes of hell from the Abyss or 9 Hells planes....in planescape.

From looking at their artwork, most of them are recognizable as D&D (ie. orcus, demogorgon, asmodeus, etc)

Sanjay

 

[Ritual]

Then don\'t bother (for GD that is...).

 

[darthfoley]

I think if you went with something clearly recognizable as D&D you\'d be putting a whole lot of work into something that wouldn\'t get you anywhere, Golden Demon wise.

Now, the satisfaction of creating a mini based on artwork you like is a different matter.

 

[Evil Dave]

Originally posted by tide of khorne

Although they are fickle, they did disqualify that Word Bearers Deamon Prince that used banners very similar to Christian Iconory, even though it fit the Word Bearers fluff.

Do you mean golgotha(wich is also a religious name)?

Yeah, that\'s the one.
Given the Word Bearer\'s fluff as theologians and chaos, the idea of using pre-emperor Icons is not that far fetched.

 

[Legacy Account]

Here\'s an idea:

Just do your stuff. Bollocks to GW.

 

[Matt Cexwish]

A General Rule of THUMB,. if its not I.P.(Identifiable product) of G.W. Dont bother ,they wont even give it a second look, no matter how brilliant it is.

You are so true, and sadly you have some experience in that already......

But sometimes GW misses to stick to their own stupid undercover rule, so on some GD you win with quite untypical miniatures... Like with this Predator Kroot... it has been done by David Waesselynck and he won in Germany...

That´s an interesting point one can 100% agree is true: On Games Workshop Golden Demon Competition... you (and them......) never know exactly, what to expect and what will win in the end...

 

[Gilvan Blight]

I would think if you did a D&D style Demon, that was obviously a self scuplt and not something put out by another mini company to represent that Demon, but then added some GW iconography you should be good. For example lots of Khorne symbols, skulls and chains for a Khorne demon. Painting in GW standard colours should help as well.

It has to look like a Warhammer Demon, not a Bloodthirster etc.

I\'m no judge though, but it\'s the flash on the mini that says GW to me.

 

[Albert Moreto Font]

i think these models are not really disqualified. i think there\'s a distinction between those minis breaking the rules directly (mixing lotr pieces with WH\'s, entering pieces of other brands, adding bits from other companies, adding nazi or whatever symbology in banners, etc etc etc) and the breaking of the rules because of style. i mean, if a mini doesnt look wh40k but star trek, it will just not win, but i dont think it will be properly disqualified. the judges will think, this is not what we\'re lookin for in Golden Demon, so it doesnt go through the 1st cut. dont know if u get my point..

 

[Albert Moreto Font]

so if you convert a mini from only GW bits or sculpt it yourself from scratch, and it looks very much another world non Gw related, or just doesnt fit with GW imaginery, you will very probably not win, but they wont disqualify you.

 

[Ogrebane]

Hey Sanjay. I think you can tell by the trend that it probably wont get thru. i didnt get thru my regional because of my mini not being GWish enough and it was all GW parts so if you do a D&D demon then you know the answers. Dont let that stop you from doing it tho. Your in a HOBBY so if you like doing it then just do it and post it here. In fact why dont you start your own painting comp and hand out a prize for the best D&D mini.

Good luck and post a pic when your done.

 

[Matt Cexwish]

A good point, I have thought abot that the same last German Games Day...

Cheeba did something together with Degra, a Sigmar Priest... Asskicking Deluxe, but the judges took the mini a wee bit aside... they KNEW it is painted brilliantly and that it is technically Perfect... but they also knew, that it looked very Rackham... so it didn´t win anything, because a very important (if not the most important rule at GD for Games Workshop...) was violated: Make it look GW... and make GW love it...

If you ignore this rule, you can be sure... you lose... because it´s their competition, if you don´t agree on what they do, go to Ravage Mix Open or Mon De Jeux... Hard, Ignorant opinion and Statement of GW, but reality you have to deal with...

All in all I am sure that people at GD would laught their asses off if they knew how serious people take this whole thing and how important some discussions are for some people... That´s quite cruel...

 

[AinuLainour]

Originally posted by Matt Cexwish
All in all I am sure that people at GD would laught their asses off if they knew how serious people take this whole thing and how important some discussions are for some people... That´s quite cruel...

That\'s what bothered me about GD Canada\'s judging, they hardly look at some models that have obviously have had a lot of time put in them (ie. Legacy40k\'s Forge World Avatar ). And what disturbed me most was that every miniature that made first cut and placed in LoTR single (despite some questionable paintjobs, imho) was on a display base, while all the models that didn\'t pass first cut had nothing but the bases they came with.

Not to derail the topic, but it seemed fitting to bring up.