Bicarbonate

[AegisD]

Quick question; I read the tutorial on snow bases (http://coolminiornot.com/article/aid/323), and was wondering what the difference is between bicarbonate of soda and sodium bicarbonate? Also if there isn\'t any difference won\'t it just turn yellow?

I\'m trying to do some snowy bases for my army but the GW flock is sort of a let down if I use it like normal flock. Ideas?

 

[mikesilk]

bi carb

no difference...just the order of words. However as inexpensive as it is i would not suggest sodium bicarb be used for snow...it does strange things when exposed to moisture. go get the woodland scenics SNOW its great stuff and has that fresh fallen snow sparkle. M:beer:

 

[exilesjjb]

for powder snow use icing sugar

 

[AegisD]

Originally posted by mikesilk
no difference...just the order of words. However as inexpensive as it is i would not suggest sodium bicarb be used for snow...it does strange things when exposed to moisture. go get the woodland scenics SNOW its great stuff and has that fresh fallen snow sparkle. M:beer:

I thought so, but some comments on the other tutorials said otherwise.

Anyway, can that woodland scenics stuff be mixed with a pva glue to make little fluffy mounds?

Originally posted by exilesjjb
for powder snow use icing sugar

Ideally I\'d like something that doesn\'t melt... Or not easily.

 

[exilesjjb]

once you have it on the figure spray varnish it will go nowhere then

 

[Amazon warrior]

Originally posted by AegisD
I\'m trying to do some snowy bases for my army but the GW flock is sort of a let down if I use it like normal flock. Ideas?

There are a few articles here that cover snow basing. I use the following method:

Mix snow with thinned white glue (~50:50 water/glue, depends on how thick your glue is) to make a thick paste. Splodge onto base in desired arrangement. Sprinkle more snow over the top. Leave for a few minutes, then shake off any excess loose snow and leave to dry thoroughly. Voila! If you\'ve done it correctly, you should now have satisfyingly fluffy mounds of snow on your base!

If you use this method, it\'s worth planning to do a few bases because you might find you end up with a lot of snow/glue mix that will go to waste otherwise. Unless you\'re very strict about quantities!

 

[Chrome]

Anyone ever tried the Cmon snow flock? I totally love it! I wouldn\'t recommend it for real gaming pieces but for those models you want to stand out or for display models. Never seen anything better. ^^

 

[Donga]

I\'ve used bicarb for snow for years without issue. It does sparkle when dry. It costs a fraction of commercial scenic snow for something that works as well if not better.

It does not go yellow either, cheap glue will go yellow. I use a good wood glue with low water content for snow and it stays white and sparkley. I have examples from 5-6 years ago that are still perfect.

Save your money!!!

 

[Donga]

I\'ve used bicarb for snow for years without issue. It does sparkle when dry. It costs a fraction of commercial scenic snow for something that works as well if not better.

It does not go yellow either, cheap glue will go yellow. I use a good wood glue with low water content for snow and it stays white and sparkley. I have examples from 5-6 years ago that are still perfect.

Save your money!!!

(dunno how this happened? Good advice is worth repeating )

 

[Einion]

AegisD, yep bicarbonate of soda and sodium bicarbonate are the same thing. The thing you want to avoid is baking powder, which contains starch and that\'ll discolour over time.

I\'ve use sodium bicarb for snow effects for many years but it does have limitations - when made into a paste and applied in small applications it can tend to absorb water from the air, enough to become little dots of moisture over a long period. I had to remove the sprinkling of fake snow from a bust because of this after a few years.

Plus it can interact with some metallic paints if they\'re made from real metal powders. This won\'t be common but I thought I\'d mention it just in case.

Originally posted by exilesjjb
for powder snow use icing sugar

No, don\'t!

Originally posted by Donga
(dunno how this happened? Good advice is worth repeating )

lol

Einion

 

[airhead]

The Woodland Scenics (& I suspect the CMON) snow is a substance called microballons. Pop into your local model airplane store (or online) and get a quart of fluffy white powder for about the same cost as the little packet. Should last the average modeler a lifetime.

If you get really serious, I\'ll tell you a place you can get a 5 gallon pail of it....

 

[tallxiii]

Just going back to the Bicarb thing, would clear coating it not prevent it form discolouring or absorbing the moisture?

 

[Dragonsreach]

Originally posted by airhead
The Woodland Scenics (& I suspect the CMON) snow is a substance called microballons. Pop into your local model airplane store (or online) and get a quart of fluffy white powder for about the same cost as the little packet. Should last the average modeler a lifetime.

If you get really serious, I\'ll tell you a place you can get a 5 gallon pail of it....

But what ever you do WEAR A FACEMASK.
It takes forever to get out of the carpet, cat or dog\'s fur if you sneeze.

 

[airhead]

Originally posted by tallxiii
Just going back to the Bicarb thing, would clear coating it not prevent it form discolouring or absorbing the moisture?

Often it is the clearcoat that yellows - ruining the snow.

 

[DXM]

If you just sprinkle Sodium Bicarbonate, should be fine. Can stain paints. I used to mix Sodium Bicarbonate into paint and brush it on as either mud or rust effect but over time moisture pulls the Bicard out and forms a white crust.

Don\'t us organic stuff for snow( ie sugar or flour ) bugs will eat anything.

As for microballoons, like Dragonsreach said, be very careful with it, wear a mask. It is powdered glass and if you breath it in it can shred your lungs. A bottle of Woodland Scenic snow will last you a life time, 1/2 a bottle will last a life time so split the cost with a friend.

 

[airhead]

Originally posted by DXM
...As for microballoons, like Dragonsreach said, be very careful with it, wear a mask. It is powdered glass and if you breath it in it can shred your lungs. A bottle of Woodland Scenic snow will last you a life time, 1/2 a bottle will last a life time so split the cost with a friend.

It is not quite powdered glass, it is a bunch of little glass spheres (a byproduct of some industrial furnace process). This causes very little irritation to the body - unlike crushed glass. Breathing a bunch would not be good, but not near as bad as crushed glass.

 

[Einion]

Originally posted by tallxiii
Just going back to the Bicarb thing, would clear coating it not prevent it form discolouring or absorbing the moisture?

Discolouring\'s not a problem - have stuff right behind me that\'s been exposed to the air for well over 10 years now, still white as could be.

As far as preventing moisture absorption, it might, but you\'d have to be confident whatever it is would not discolour itself.

Originally posted by airhead

Originally posted by DXM
...As for microballoons, like Dragonsreach said, be very careful with it, wear a mask. It is powdered glass and if you breath it in it can shred your lungs. A bottle of Woodland Scenic snow will last you a life time, 1/2 a bottle will last a life time so split the cost with a friend.

It is not quite powdered glass, it is a bunch of little glass spheres (a byproduct of some industrial furnace process). This causes very little irritation to the body - unlike crushed glass. Breathing a bunch would not be good, but not near as bad as crushed glass.

QFT

Einion

 

[AegisD]

I see... SO, it isn\'t the bicarb that yellows, but the glue... Ok. Well, I\'ll give it a shot on some spare bases then, and see how it turns out. Thanks for the help guys!

Oh and thanks Einion, my Necrons are all metallic (GW brand, which uses aluminum flakes as far as I know) so I\'ll be careful not to get too much on them without a protective coat first.

Also, I\'ve found the GW brand works wonders if you just drybrush some white on, then drybrush some glue on and sprinkle it on there.

EDIT: What type of wood glue doesn\'t fall into the \"cheap\" category. Everything outside of GWs brand is usually only $2-$4 a bottle. Are we talking about Wal-mart brand stuff here? Or will Elmers yellow too?

 

[Einion]

Originally posted by AegisD
Oh and thanks Einion, my Necrons are all metallic (GW brand, which uses aluminum flakes as far as I know) so I\'ll be careful not to get too much on them without a protective coat first.

Glad I mentioned it then, just in case

Originally posted by AegisD
EDIT: What type of wood glue doesn\'t fall into the \"cheap\" category. Everything outside of GWs brand is usually only $2-$4 a bottle. Are we talking about Wal-mart brand stuff here? Or will Elmers yellow too?

Elmer\'s Glue-All? I have heard mention of it supposedly yellowing on the forums but it is PVA so it should work fine.

I use a cheap craft-store PVA and it\'s worked great for me. I have some pieces that are about six or seven years old and no discolouration.

Einion