Bloody hard blood angels...

[akiefer]

Hi all,

I am still trudging on with my first set of marines wich I\'ve decided to paint red. You have read an earlier mail where I could not really get a grip on a good red coverage. I tried the tips supplied there and they helped! So why agian here? Well... I did some layering and things started to get really hopeful until I went to the ink wash stage and I have managed to ruin everything I\'ve done so far.

On some marines the inl just dried into a matte grey garble and on some it stained tho whole figure almost completely black.

After this I tried bluidling up some reds again and I found that the colors either did not \'stick\' to the surface for proper build up or they went completely chalkey.

Here are a series of pictures with a request for some tips if I can get them out of this tight spot. I gues all starts are frustrating

Thanks in advance,
Albert

 

[matty1001]

They look really buggered! What colour ink did you use, it would look great if you were going for the weathered look though!
I rekon the best bet is to strip em and start again.

 

[farseerlum]

that is just weird! how can you get a matte result from an ink wash?

i\'m guessing you put some other \"stuff\" in with the wash. you\'ll have to \'fess up with that, i\'m betting thats the culprit.

 

[Talonicus]

I am not sure what you have done to them, maybe the paint wasnt dry before you applied your ink.
Was the ink watered down?
But I really like the effect on some of them.
Its something I must try to replicate.

Nigel

 

[akiefer]

Oh yes I forgot,

I added VGC (Vallejo Game Color) Glaze Medium to GW Black Ink. I did some with a lot of glaze medium and those are the ones that give that Grey line dirty look. The ones that have more black just used a less dilluted version (I.E. less glaze medium to ink ratio)

I probably read something wrong when I read somewhere on the brushthralls.com site that he used a 16:1 Glaze medium to paint ratio. He probably did not use ink but actual paint.

Maybe I will take the positive and make two of them rally weathered looking. But how can you explain the non covering chalky look? Too watered down? I used a ratio of maybe 6:1 water | paint ratio.

Albert

 

[akiefer]

By the way as you probably know these are plastic models... can they be stripped too?

I think even the weathered ones would need a cleaner looking helmet

Albert

 

[farseerlum]

ahh now were talking.

first black as a wash never works. use either a complementry color or a darker tone of the one your using.

so a green ink would be better. or a dark red. purple can work noce too to give a slight tint.

second ink is already a glaze water is all you should realy need. you shouldn\'t need any medium as well. if you want to add anything add something to break the surface tension so it flows a bit better. a minute amount of dishwashing liquid would do the trick.

third thanks for the tip. glaze medium makes good weathering effcts.

for a glaze i think most would go higher than 10:1 water to ink. really thin is what were talking. it\'s hard to get off so put less on in the first place and you can do it again if your wanting more later.

 

[freakinacage]

before you think about stripping them, you may be able to bring back the colour using a red ink. but you can strip plastic using brake fluid (leave it overnight)

 

[GreenOne]

What I wonder is how you could have let it go so far before you noticed the mixture didn\'t work Even if you are in a hurry, mishaps like that make you lose time right?
For experiments and first tries, go one surface at a time, let it dry, and see the results.. this way you won\'t need to strip a box of marines because of one mistake...
As for the glaze medium, if you read the indications, you would not just splash it into a mix, it\'s a powerful stuff... It think it messed up the paint underneat

 

[akiefer]

You won\'t believe how NOt in a hurry I was . These three already have taken me over a week to get to this messed up state. They were more or less fine before the wash stage and that is pretty much how you see them now The was was put on quite liberally so it took like a day and a half to dry and surprise me with this result. All the good hope I had of actually getting somewhere were crushed when I saw this

But, I hope I am learning... Maybe I just want to do/ try too much at once and lose perspective.

Albert

 

[diddy lemon1]

i might us ethis tecnigue to wether my city fight army lol

 

[akiefer]

Oh and by the way FreakInaCage,

Do I need to do diluted red ink or full force?

Am am being careful next time I put on inks now (Lessons learnt!)

Albert

 

[freakinacage]

Originally posted by akiefer
Oh and by the way FreakInaCage,

Do I need to do diluted red ink or full force?

Am am being careful next time I put on inks now (Lessons learnt!)

Albert

not sure. i\'d dilute it a little at least 50/50 to start with. and only use water to dilute, nothing fancy. its worth a try eh?!

 

[demonherald]

These are saveable the good thing is you\'ve thinned your paint so you won\'t lose the details...

The first one is possibly down to the thinness of the paint.. To build red up like that over black will take a lot of coats and a lot of patience that will look great.

Key thing there get to a certain point with the mix and let it dry thoroughly.. Start off with Scab Red and A little Scorched Brown and mix in red gore adding more for each layer until pure red gore..Stop at this point to let the layers dry as it\'s easier to remember where to start when you go back.Then start adding in Blood Red to the Red Gore to get your final colour.

That\'s the first one....(got a final bit but see below)

The next ones a couple of ink washes will help..

2 Parts Red ink 1 part Brown ink 6 parts spotlessly clean water.. This is the key the effect you\'ve got often comes from dirt in the water. but the amount of VMC glaze medium in Black ink will make grey never a good thing (although I agree on the weathering effect)
To make sure your not putting too much ink on the brush (that causes the blotchy pooling you have got) load up the brush and hold it bristles down and tap the top of the handle if a drop forms in the bristles you have too much.

As a final finisher for both glaze with red and brown ink..

this time 1 part red 2 parts brown then 8-10 parts water...(remeber clean) load the brush in the same way and do approx 3-4 coats or until your happy with the finish.

good luck and hope they come out ok......

 

[DrEvilmonki]

I would recomend you don\'t wash the entire figure with ink either. You are using it to shade in this case? Then just put it where the shading would be, don\'t load your brush, put a small amount of ink on at a time and blend it into the shadows just like you highlight up. You build up the shadows with multiple layers, this gives you far more control over how dark you make the shadows and helps prevent tide marks as the ink dries.
I actually use matt medium in my inks as well to get rid of that shineyness, you\'ve just used to much. You can also use dark shaded paintbut thinned down.
And as was said don\'t shade with black (in most cases) as it will just make the model look dirty rather than shaded.

 

[akiefer]

I\'ve given all three a complete wash with red ink (diluted and several layers) and at least the greyish grime has gone. So I\'ll be trying to pick up painting on top of this now.

Since the surface is now quite smooth and glossy do I need to prepare it for some new paint coats (that will be matte (Vallejo GC) or can I just start layering the paint on top of this inked surface?

Albert

I\'ll show some pics later this morning...

At least I have my hopes back I can see this more shiny surface as a nice starting point for some oily worn armour surfaces so I\'ll try some worn down to bare metal sections on the joints much like industrial machinery would have. Maybe these guys greased their armoured plates in the field with just what they had at hand. Let\'s see if I can pull that off.

 

[akiefer]

here are some pics of the situation now...

 

[OrkyDave]

Good save goalie!

look fine to me now, phew!

 

[GreenOne]

The result is actually pretty interesting...
You\'ll probably have someone asking you how you did it lol

 

[akiefer]

It now actually looks also like some burnished red tinted leather. Should be great for samurai swordsmen

But actually yes at least they are in a state that allows me to continue on them.

Albert