Celtos - Keltois

[Coyote]

I was at a website that was talking about how great I-Kore was and for one second I blanked on what they made and got a little excited.

Then, on looking at their stuff I realized that it was essentially chunky versions of GW and Rackham concepts.

How can people just sit back and allow one company to obviously copy the intellectual property of another company?

 

[Errex]

Easy...

Just spell the names different, pick a concept that\'s loosely based on real life ancient tribes and always say \"Uh?\", when asked about it...

lol

 

[vincegamer]

Don\'t think you can say they are \"copying\" anything.
A war game using small figurines to represent soldiers from either a historic or mythic past (or future) is hardly anyone\'s proprietary intellectual property. It\'s not as if GW and Rackham were innovators.
Of course, I haven\'t read the rules, but I assume there is enough difference in how the traits are used and what dice are rolled.

 

[Coyote]

I\'m talking more about the miniatures themselves.

I e-mailed Ikor, and they said essentially that they\'ve been designing celtic/barbarian style miniatures since 1990.

They also said that there were going to be some similarities since they have some people working for them that used to work for Rackham.

They also said that Rackham Orcs are similar to GW.

I just wish companies would come out with new lines, instead of rehashing other companies lines.

I find rackham miniatures to be very innovative, from pose and body shape to weapon and clothing style. They don\'t look anything like any other company\'s work.

Well, they do now, since I-kore released Keltois, I mean, Celtos.

Use the force Kimba, I mean, Simba.

 

[AAvH-Darkblade]

Based on Ancient Celtic Mythology

Originally posted by Coyote
I\'m talking more about the miniatures themselves.

I e-mailed Ikor, and they said essentially that they\'ve been designing celtic/barbarian style miniatures since 1990.

They also said that there were going to be some similarities since they have some people working for them that used to work for Rackham.

They also said that Rackham Orcs are similar to GW.

I just wish companies would come out with new lines, instead of rehashing other companies lines.

I find rackham miniatures to be very innovative, from pose and body shape to weapon and clothing style. They don\'t look anything like any other company\'s work.

Well, they do now, since I-kore released Keltois, I mean, Celtos.

Use the force Kimba, I mean, Simba.

Maybe you should look a little closer at the miniatures and the names of the miniatures from I-Kore Celtos line.

1) They look nothing like Rackham miniature. Stylistically they are much cleaner. Not better or worse, but quite different in style, size and form.

2) Conceptually they are based on ancient Celtic Legend, very closely based. I suggest you pick up a book or two on Celtic legend, you\'ll see what I mean.

3) Almost all Fantasy miniature lines owe a huge debt to both Tolkien and ancient mythology.

Both lines are very nice for very different stylistic reasons, so chill.

Darkblade

 

[AAvH-Darkblade]

Also....

Also, you will notice in the English Translation of the rules for Confrontation (originally French) they refer to the \"Keltois\" as the \"Barbarians\"....

 

[finn17]

Rackham same as i-Kore?!?

I really think you need to look again. I am a relatively old SOB and have painted minis from many companies over the last 30 years. I suppose I really cut my teeth on Citadel/GW. However all these figures are based on images/characters/intellectual property that already existed. Celtos/Keltois = Celts. Almost every other company makes similar models eg. Chronopia. Some Celtos figures figures are even named, for God\'s sake, as they represent specific figures in mythology ie Balor Cernunnos, etc. This is hardly nicking another company\'s intellectual property.
Another important feature is that the representations themselves are TOTALLY different in every way. IMO i-Kore make miniatures aimed squarely at the mini wargamer. Their minis are very chunky, dead easy to paint to a good standard and suitable for even the most dick-fingered brush jockey. Rackham, on the other hand produce the most fantastically imaginative figures that are truly innovative but the son-of-satan themselves to paint to a decent standard. Look through this site for evidence if you don\'t believe me.
As for infringing intellectual copyright however it\'s a simple non-starter, just as if both companies produced a figure of Julius Caesar. I suppose if he was alive he might object...

 

[Maori]

Intellectual Property?

I am completely in agreement with finn here, and totally shocked out of my collecting-miniatures-since-the-70\'s socks that anyone would find I-Kore and Rackham models similar!!!!
Is this a fanboy attack on potential competitors for their beloved Empire?
Can\'t even count the number of concepts and original ideas by somebody else GW is ripping off for their stuff.

 

[Coyote]

Actually I\'ve bought neither. I just think that the Celtos Sword Maidens and Rackham fianna are much more similar then they need to be.

Really, all I wish is for a company to break from what their competitors are doing and do something new.

 

[AAvH-Darkblade]

Originally posted by Coyote
Actually I\'ve bought neither. I just think that the Celtos Sword Maidens and Rackham fianna are much more similar then they need to be.

Really, all I wish is for a company to break from what their competitors are doing and do something new.

Maybe, you should consider how your comments are percieved before starting a thread. Instead of attacking one company with broad, sweeping and I would strongly suggest inaccurate statements. You should have perhaps started with you last comment, giving some examples in support. What we write is our legacy in these forums and a foot print on the internet, neither are to be taken lightly, even though we use handles.

Darkblade

 

[Coyote]

You are right Darkblade.

In fact, I\'ve apologized to the people I really hurt in this - I-kore.

The barbarian chick in skimpy armour with the big sword has been done and redone more then a few times over the years. Rackham wasn\'t the first.

I still maintain my one point, that I wish that things weren\'t so similar. Lets see an industry where miniature makers can safely embark on new lines, without fear of failing because they aren\'t producing the flavour of the week.

 

[vincegamer]

First, beyond \"woman with funky hair wearing bikini and wielding ridiculous sword\" I see no similarity at all between the two named lines. There are others though that are very similar, and GW apparently has mostly defined what dwarves are (until Rackham\'s horrors came along).

Now, concerning originality.
If you are doing a fantasy realm, there are certain staples you have to have to get an audience: dwarves, elves, barbarians.
Beyond that, I think 100 kingdoms is doing a great job coming up with new stuff.

If originality is truly what you want, try 100k or China Town, or Future Wars, or Pulp Figures, etc.
If you\'re looking for figures that simply look different from GW I\'d suggest you take a look at Armalion.

Sure, GW, Rackham and now I-Kore are pretty well known names (not that they were 1 year ago mind you, my local shop had not heard of Rackham at that time), but that doesn\'t mean they are it. There are hundreds of manufacturers out there, and while all have similarities as I mentioned before, some are quite strikingly different.

 

[Maori]

similar?

Yeah, man, I really hate the fact that all these minis are made of metal or plastic, can\'t they come up with something more original, like ...playdo, only shiny, and with ice cream....
:bouncy:
Boy did you ever miss the mark comparing the Rackham Fiannas to the I-Kore Gael Gals!!!:flame:
I am looking at one of each right now, and not only are they completely different scales and body structures, the sculpting, design, iconography, and probably even molecular structure are not only not in the same ballpark, they\'re not even in the same league!!!
There\'s plenty of sameness in the world of fantasy miniatures, to be sure, but your example isn\'t valid.
I , for one, am getting a little tired of the \'nordic dwarf\' syndrome, or the elves as nothing other than tall, pointy eared humans with really good missile stats.
As sad of a ststement as that may be, Kenzer\'s \'Fairy Meat\' is probably among the most original concepts to come out in recent years.
Hundred Kingdoms is up there, too, along with the weird, almost sick sado-maso stuff from Dark Age.

 

[Flashman14]

[sniff] nobody likes Vampire Wars . . . who else is doing classic horror minis in that magnitude . . that range is near definitive in it\'s scope too . . .