paintingploddy
New member
Thanks Vike, timely comments for this painter.
French heresy ?
- Thread starter Tony Manero
- Start date
Yeah, I agree with Supervike. I\'ve nothing against \"technically\" great, but I know I\'ve left at least one comment on a mini along the lines of \"awesome technical ability, but no soul\".
I also at least partly agree with the original post, there are some amazing minis, but they\'ve been changed so much, they aren\'t GW anymore, for GD it should be GW, if its just a mini then, yeah whatever you want.
I also at least partly agree with the original post, there are some amazing minis, but they\'ve been changed so much, they aren\'t GW anymore, for GD it should be GW, if its just a mini then, yeah whatever you want.
Before I state my opinion, let me prepare.
*Puts on a leather jerkin, then chainmail, then a Kevlar vest, then a suit of full plate armor.*
I find myself agreeing with the GW staff member somewhat. I know that I may never acheive the NMM abilities of Arjay, or the sheer amazing painting skills of Dragonsreach, much less the level of detail that many here can display with what seems to everyone else like amazing ease. However, I also agree with what the man/woman is saying.
He/she\'s saying that the hobby is in a rut. We have absolutely amazing painters, however since the MM (NMM, SENMM, CNMM. M&M, MNMM, ect.) \"revolution\" we see it used all over the place. We have yet to see very many new styles erupt as they did durring the times when NMM first became popular (It\'s odd thinking that I\'ve been in the hobby that long actually...). We\'ve also seen a dramatic increase in the use of NMM, and for the life of me I still wonder where all these damn manicured battlefeilds are! I need to hire those guys to cut my lawn for me! Seriously though, you see very few \'different\' types and styles. I know we can do better. \"We\" because this site is the largest gathering of multi-national award winnning miniature painters, whether it\'s a simple award at the local gaming store, a Slayer\'s Sword, or inter-national recognition of your skill as a painter and sculptor.
What he\'s saying is to not be bland. Don\'t follow the crowd :bouncy::bouncy:! Create your own style
and if the world doesn\'t like it at first then :moon: :moon: to them!
P.S. I would love to see a lot more EricJ\'s at GDs than simple NMM.
*Puts on a leather jerkin, then chainmail, then a Kevlar vest, then a suit of full plate armor.*
I find myself agreeing with the GW staff member somewhat. I know that I may never acheive the NMM abilities of Arjay, or the sheer amazing painting skills of Dragonsreach, much less the level of detail that many here can display with what seems to everyone else like amazing ease. However, I also agree with what the man/woman is saying.
He/she\'s saying that the hobby is in a rut. We have absolutely amazing painters, however since the MM (NMM, SENMM, CNMM. M&M, MNMM, ect.) \"revolution\" we see it used all over the place. We have yet to see very many new styles erupt as they did durring the times when NMM first became popular (It\'s odd thinking that I\'ve been in the hobby that long actually...). We\'ve also seen a dramatic increase in the use of NMM, and for the life of me I still wonder where all these damn manicured battlefeilds are! I need to hire those guys to cut my lawn for me! Seriously though, you see very few \'different\' types and styles. I know we can do better. \"We\" because this site is the largest gathering of multi-national award winnning miniature painters, whether it\'s a simple award at the local gaming store, a Slayer\'s Sword, or inter-national recognition of your skill as a painter and sculptor.
What he\'s saying is to not be bland. Don\'t follow the crowd :bouncy::bouncy:! Create your own style
and if the world doesn\'t like it at first then :moon: :moon: to them!P.S. I would love to see a lot more EricJ\'s at GDs than simple NMM.
Dark Seraphim
New member
@Dedwrekka: Agree But keep one thing in mind, some of us haven\'t known about NMM or SENMM and how awesome it looks (because cmon, it does when done properly...) and thus, for us it is new. I only discovered it after I came online here, I\'ve always just gone out from White Dwarf and Army books for inspiration and then creating my own style from that. This gives me an oppertunaty to expand my painting experience, as a matter of fact, I just finished my first SENMM NMM attempt last night, and I\'m very proud of myself.
What you need to understand, is that everyone starts somewhere, personal style doesn\'t just come out of nowhere.
And I agree, EricJ style would be awesome to see at GD\'s. But if you look at the GD site, you will actually see alot of new types and styles there, and not just old. (specially when looking back 10 years)
But keep one thing in mind, some of us haven\'t known about NMM or SENMM and how awesome it looks (because cmon, it does when done properly...) and thus, for us it is new. I only discovered it after I came online here, I\'ve always just gone out from White Dwarf and Army books for inspiration and then creating my own style from that. This gives me an oppertunaty to expand my painting experience, as a matter of fact, I just finished my first SENMM NMM attempt last night, and I\'m very proud of myself.What you need to understand, is that everyone starts somewhere, personal style doesn\'t just come out of nowhere.
And I agree, EricJ style would be awesome to see at GD\'s. But if you look at the GD site, you will actually see alot of new types and styles there, and not just old. (specially when looking back 10 years)
We need a Shrubbery ! ,Sorry ,NO , A GLOSSARY !
Reading peoples coments is always very interesting ,BUT....To a technophobe who at 45 still hasnt mastered the English language ,WHAT do all the capital letters & abreviations MEAN ! It took me 2 weeks to work out what CMON stood for ??? GOD bless .........VINCENTI
Reading peoples coments is always very interesting ,BUT....To a technophobe who at 45 still hasnt mastered the English language ,WHAT do all the capital letters & abreviations MEAN ! It took me 2 weeks to work out what CMON stood for ??? GOD bless .........VINCENTI
Dark Seraphim
New member
Half the MM\'s Dedwrekka mentioned I have no idea what are
3 months ago I had no idea what NMM stood for... I guess we all learn erm... he said quite the opposite in my opinion, and actually said that it was a heresy that the french (in this example) weren\'t painting in a style that fits the rich GW history, and that their painting has no soul. I think the last thing that the top french painters do is follow the crowd!
I also dont agree that we have stagnated at all. Vincenti is a good example of a new style creeping into the sci-fi/fantasy painting scene - we are seeing a bloody good historical/large scale painter applying the techniques and theory from that into this hobby. And a damn good job of it he\'s doing too
There are a number of different styles around the world, and maybe at CMoN we are seeing some homogenisation, but I think it is to everyone\'s benefit.
TTFN
Edit: Just re-reading what the GW guy said, and in fact i can see his point of view, and would agree that some of the style doesnt necessarily fit into the GW imagery, but is certainly not souless. For me its the opposite of (i think) Bobby Wong\'s Leonatus and the ultramarine captain that he did... which were unbelievably well painted, and fit the imagery, but did not have a soul
Orb
procrastinator
Rev - hope you\'re over this now.....but I get the giggles everytime I look at it lol
interesting discussion; I hope someone one asked for specific examples of the GW guy\'s comments. Nothing like untrue generalisation to wind folks up.
Reinterpreting GW\'s style........; that\'s interesting - what is GW style exactly? Style of GW art changes from artist to artist; If we\'re talking about mini\'s does that mean the style = Heavy Metal! Nooooooo!!! Avicenna is right - it\'s souless.
It all boils down to what we want when we\'re being judged in this hobby; GW, ultimately are too restrictive yet also erratic in what qualifies as a winning mini; however, the catch 22 is that it is the recognised competition worldwide for this \"genre\" of mini. other competitions exist, but are not so prestigious
The French have simply led the way in breaking away from GW\'s norm
interesting discussion; I hope someone one asked for specific examples of the GW guy\'s comments. Nothing like untrue generalisation to wind folks up.
Reinterpreting GW\'s style........; that\'s interesting - what is GW style exactly? Style of GW art changes from artist to artist; If we\'re talking about mini\'s does that mean the style = Heavy Metal! Nooooooo!!! Avicenna is right - it\'s souless.
It all boils down to what we want when we\'re being judged in this hobby; GW, ultimately are too restrictive yet also erratic in what qualifies as a winning mini; however, the catch 22 is that it is the recognised competition worldwide for this \"genre\" of mini. other competitions exist, but are not so prestigious
The French have simply led the way in breaking away from GW\'s norm
Well done Tony. You\'ve found an online translator for Flatulence!
G
Ghmork
Guest
Originally posted by Tony Manero
(Imho i love french style and i think it\'s one of the best way of painting, just my thought
But check what the head of GW webstaff said of our italian forum.
\"
(we was talking about the french minis, and someone said that the french style is the best, so the GW webstaff head replied)
\"This is just a point of view, for us they have heresy within. Reinterpretating GW style is a fact, changing it totally just for self-pleasure itsn\'t the same thing. Noone is judging the quality of french minis, they just overdo. I know i\'ll result unpopular but the faultless painting, the exasperation of originality (just for self pleasuring) and the exclusive use of NMM (a bidimensional technic applied on a tridimensional object -shiver-) makes perfect minis just boring. They are not so enanched, they are only travelling on a line that will change in a dead-end. They will change.\"
It leaves me astonished
1- Isn\'t GW a Worldwide company?? why internal discussions?
2- An internal GW staff member can\'t say such things. Is disrespectful.
3- Almost all of French GD winners are in Real Metal.
I\'m tired of being italian
i\'m afraid Tony this is only a stupid provocation that will neither help gw italian staff to increase italian gd quality,neither will help you to look nice at the eyes of this international comunity.
topic like that never lead on nice end and only cousing much aggro,expecially when enriched with some personal opinions.
if you was interessed in that discussion on italian forum, you bether partecipate on the discussion there, instead of come on this forum and report your personal idea of that. imho to me really sound like those discussion some old womans had from theyr hairdresser when they are really bored.
@GHMork
I\'m hoping that your posting on here is a rather poor translation because it can be read as somewhat rude!
The majority of the posters on here express their distaste for comments which are plainly Blinkered.
Which, if you\'d read the following comments to Tony\'s post, you would see are, in the majority, quite dismissive of the sentiments expressed by that GW staff member.
Given that you are a new member, I\'d suggest that you read the few rules about these forums.
I\'m hoping that your posting on here is a rather poor translation because it can be read as somewhat rude!
The majority of the posters on here express their distaste for comments which are plainly Blinkered.
Which, if you\'d read the following comments to Tony\'s post, you would see are, in the majority, quite dismissive of the sentiments expressed by that GW staff member.
Given that you are a new member, I\'d suggest that you read the few rules about these forums.
philologus
Subgenius
Originally posted by EArkham:
\"That and $3 buys him a cup of coffee.\"
$3! Must be Starbucks coffee
Originally posted by EbonBuddha:
\"Thats why (I think so anyway) the GD judges are starting to give gold, silver, and bronze to the \"sucky\" paint jobs\"
Excellent news for me!
\"That and $3 buys him a cup of coffee.\"
$3! Must be Starbucks coffee
Originally posted by EbonBuddha:
\"Thats why (I think so anyway) the GD judges are starting to give gold, silver, and bronze to the \"sucky\" paint jobs\"
Excellent news for me!
G
Ghmork
Guest
Originally posted by Dragonsreach
@GHMork
I\'m hoping that your posting on here is a rather poor translation because it can be read as somewhat rude!
The majority of the posters on here express their distaste for comments which are plainly Blinkered.
Which, if you\'d read the following comments to Tony\'s post, you would see are, in the majority, quite dismissive of the sentiments expressed by that GW staff member.
Given that you are a new member, I\'d suggest that you read the few rules about these forums.
well i apologize if that could sound rude, anyway i don\'t like when people extract sone semtence from a general discussion and use it in another place with peoples that don\'t actually know anything about that only for provocating and all.
Not in the UK, It\'s more like £2.90 ($5.33)
Tony Manero
New member
Originally posted by Ghmork
Originally posted by Dragonsreach
@GHMork
I\'m hoping that your posting on here is a rather poor translation because it can be read as somewhat rude!
The majority of the posters on here express their distaste for comments which are plainly Blinkered.
Which, if you\'d read the following comments to Tony\'s post, you would see are, in the majority, quite dismissive of the sentiments expressed by that GW staff member.
Given that you are a new member, I\'d suggest that you read the few rules about these forums.
well i apologize if that could sound rude, anyway i don\'t like when people extract sone semtence from a general discussion and use it in another place with peoples that don\'t actually know anything about that only for provocating and all.
no provocating here, this is just the thing he said. And i explained also the discussion topic.
Ps i would gladly comment this sentence on the italian forum but they banned me from it when i tryed to underline the mod\'s excessive cutting-editing-mania
Fortunately we are lucky to be able to have quite mature discussions here and people (most of the time) come to their own decisions.
The more I read what the GW guy said the more i reinterprate it. I think all he is saying is that in his opinion, the minis dont fit in with the GW imagery, and that to his eye the faultless painting and the use of nmm (which is actually an inaccurate assumption as has been said before) adds up to something that does not interest him and is boring in its perfection.
So in fact, he really isnt saying anything too bad, and that over reacting to his post is probably completely inapropriate. Each to their own, but there is still an emphasis on rules and background in a number of the categories, for example -
\"Judges will be looking for units that best exemplify the qualities and character of the army they represent.\"
\"Paint schemes should demonstrate originality, imagination and consistency with the spirit of the game worlds\"
\"We are looking for well-painted and brilliantly executed models that really capture the essence of our fictional worlds, but also the spirit of what fantasy and science fiction modelling can be at its best. \"
The more I read what the GW guy said the more i reinterprate it. I think all he is saying is that in his opinion, the minis dont fit in with the GW imagery, and that to his eye the faultless painting and the use of nmm (which is actually an inaccurate assumption as has been said before) adds up to something that does not interest him and is boring in its perfection.
So in fact, he really isnt saying anything too bad, and that over reacting to his post is probably completely inapropriate. Each to their own, but there is still an emphasis on rules and background in a number of the categories, for example -
\"Judges will be looking for units that best exemplify the qualities and character of the army they represent.\"
\"Paint schemes should demonstrate originality, imagination and consistency with the spirit of the game worlds\"
\"We are looking for well-painted and brilliantly executed models that really capture the essence of our fictional worlds, but also the spirit of what fantasy and science fiction modelling can be at its best. \"
Legacy Account
Active member
I now own that mini. The only thing I\'ve ever bought by someone else, and it\'s ACE! When he said it wasn\'t painted round the back, he certainly wasn\'t lying!
There are plenty of cocks who work for GW. Sad thing is that GW kids believe a lot of the BS and misinformation that gets spouted by some of their staff.
The whole \'GW Imagery [size=-5]TM[/size]\' thing is a load of crap too. If they don\'t want people to paint their stuff anymore, perhaps they should start selling the sort of shit Wizkids knock out.
Is it any wonder their market share is dwindling. Muppets.
I still don\'t see what\'s so evil about his statement. From what i see he says he doesn\'t like the french style all that much because it\'s all technique and no sentiment and he doesn\'t like NMM.
It\'s not like he banishes all French painters from every GD there is. Just because he happens to work for GW, it\'s as if satan himself has spoken (i do not say he is, i do not say he isn\'t)?
He even includes some arguments as to why he doesn\'t like it, which in my opinion is better then people who anonymously (sp?) snipe other peoples mini\'s or do something similar...
It\'s not like he banishes all French painters from every GD there is. Just because he happens to work for GW, it\'s as if satan himself has spoken (i do not say he is, i do not say he isn\'t)?
He even includes some arguments as to why he doesn\'t like it, which in my opinion is better then people who anonymously (sp?) snipe other peoples mini\'s or do something similar...
