BarstoolProphet
New member
Somehow, I don\'t think I\'m going to brag about it in that manner.
\"I\'m a total blabber-mouth. It\'s a gift. Really!\"
\"I\'m a total blabber-mouth. It\'s a gift. Really!\"
Gift of God
- Thread starter Infidel Castro
- Start date
sanctuary13
New member
agnosticism is a gift from god.
DarkStar
New member
Usually I find anyone that does art to a high level is very humble. When I don\'t see that trait exhibited in someone of great skill at painting or sculpting it\'s ...unusual, very uncommon.
So yeah it would stand out if I heard someone refer to themselves as gifted by god, unless I knew they were autistic savants and then maybe, yes.
Even someone...a person at the pinnacle of mankind\'s endeavors to create art, say Michaelangelo for instance, I think he would be diminished if someone described him as gifted by god. He knew damn well all the years of practice, work, study, discipline, and toil that it took him to create the kind of body of work that would earn him the title \"gifted\" and would be almost insulted by that description I would think.
The term gifted implies that a thing is given instead of earned.
As if at the end of two weeks, 80 hours at work, your boss hands you your check and says \"Here\'s your gift.\" I mean...didn\'t you earn that? A gift? Really now.
Ah well yeah very strange to hear someone speaking about themselves in those terms.
Now that being said, for what it\'s worth maybe the person was speaking about the \"opportunity\" to be able to paint coming as a gift from god. Wherein we find the person is just expressing gratitude for the sheer act of being able to paint, as in \"My ability to paint minis is a gift from god.\" meaning they are just happy and feeling fortunate to be able to paint at all.
Hard to say exactly without knowing the exact context of it all so I\'ll leave my thoughts on it as such.
*edit: meant discipline, wrote doctrine.
So yeah it would stand out if I heard someone refer to themselves as gifted by god, unless I knew they were autistic savants and then maybe, yes.
Even someone...a person at the pinnacle of mankind\'s endeavors to create art, say Michaelangelo for instance, I think he would be diminished if someone described him as gifted by god. He knew damn well all the years of practice, work, study, discipline, and toil that it took him to create the kind of body of work that would earn him the title \"gifted\" and would be almost insulted by that description I would think.
The term gifted implies that a thing is given instead of earned.
As if at the end of two weeks, 80 hours at work, your boss hands you your check and says \"Here\'s your gift.\" I mean...didn\'t you earn that? A gift? Really now.
Ah well yeah very strange to hear someone speaking about themselves in those terms.
Now that being said, for what it\'s worth maybe the person was speaking about the \"opportunity\" to be able to paint coming as a gift from god. Wherein we find the person is just expressing gratitude for the sheer act of being able to paint, as in \"My ability to paint minis is a gift from god.\" meaning they are just happy and feeling fortunate to be able to paint at all.
Hard to say exactly without knowing the exact context of it all so I\'ll leave my thoughts on it as such.
*edit: meant discipline, wrote doctrine.
ScottRadom
Shogun of Saskatchewan
I agree 100% with you about the level of talent USUALLY being on par with the individuals humbleness. Most supremely talented individuals have worked to hard and long to hone their craft to a high level to refer to themselves in any way that might involve some sort of seperation from the typical individual. They tend to act like they know truly, that if they can do what they do, anyone can. Or something like that.
BUT...... How many moderately talented people do you know with a HUGE chip on their shoulders that seems to have gotten their WAY ahead of the talent. And this post better not be the definition of irony!
What I think Reverend is talking about, and I see it all too often is the indivual who be it through spiritual means or whatever WAY overestimates their talent. Using Reverend example of a 6.5-7.5 painter (again... this guy could be me!) who refers to their talent as a gift rather then refering to their enjoyment of the hobby as a gift seems to draw some negative attention.
Man, I really wanna know the specifics! SPILL!
BUT...... How many moderately talented people do you know with a HUGE chip on their shoulders that seems to have gotten their WAY ahead of the talent. And this post better not be the definition of irony!
What I think Reverend is talking about, and I see it all too often is the indivual who be it through spiritual means or whatever WAY overestimates their talent. Using Reverend example of a 6.5-7.5 painter (again... this guy could be me!) who refers to their talent as a gift rather then refering to their enjoyment of the hobby as a gift seems to draw some negative attention.
Man, I really wanna know the specifics! SPILL!
BarstoolProphet
New member
@reverend: Drive him nuts. Make your next post :
\"I know something you don\'t know.\"
Put you down? ???
I\'m not sure what you read that gave you the impression that my intent was to \'put you down\'... I was merely giving my opinion on the issue.
As I see it, there are two ways to view it: either this person\'s talent IS a gift from God (even if only in their own eyes) or it isn\'t. But either way I see no value in \'bursting their bubble\' as it were.
As to the last line in my post, I\'m simply pointing out that there are much greater things for all of us to worry about than from whence a person believes they have derived their painting skills...however good or bad they may be.
No offense intended and no put down offered...
Do you disagree with what I\'ve said? Is there a productive reason to rain on this guy\'s parade?
I\'m inclined to believe that if there were, the question may have been unnecessary? Rhetorical?
Then again, perhaps it was and I have misread it...
Either way, please don\'t misunderstand me. My intent isn\'t to put you or anyone else down. You asked a question and I offered my opinion.
fiesta0618
New member
I have no idea who this guy is, of course, but I\'ll go ahead and give him the benefit of the doubt. I could easily see that by saying he has \"a gift from God\" he actually IS trying to be humble. I mean, it\'s all a matter of his perspective. CMON plays host to some of the best mini artists around, right? That said, I have no doubt that he\'s the best mini artist he\'s ever known personally. Heck, I can say that about myself and he\'s a better painter than I! Even earning not-bad-not-great 6.5-7.5 scores on this site, he\'s achieving results that some of my gamer-first buddies will probably never. To be honest, I have used that phrase about myself once or twice (for track & field, though, not painting)...and for me, it was always a way to remind myself that my successes, however modest and however much they demanded, are no reason to place myself above anyone else. Maybe that\'s how he sees it?
Of course, if the real issue here is the \"God\" gift, well, we\'ll be here all day and get nowhere. Faith has nothing to do with logic/reasoning by its very definition, after all. Meh.
Of course, if the real issue here is the \"God\" gift, well, we\'ll be here all day and get nowhere. Faith has nothing to do with logic/reasoning by its very definition, after all. Meh.
laurence
Brushlover
A.C. Syndrome
I\'d guess it\'s Alex Castro that we\'re talking about. And in that case, I\'d spot him on it. As in, the guy next door with his garage kit is doing a better job of it. (Sorry, I can\'t resist having another dig at Mr. Castro.)
If the guy\'s a nice guy, I\'d probably just let it slide. If he\'s a tw*t, I\'d let him know that he needs to get over himself and wake up. After all, there\'s nothing like a good reality check to put your arse into gear, and motivate you to start working on really improving.
I\'d guess it\'s Alex Castro that we\'re talking about. And in that case, I\'d spot him on it. As in, the guy next door with his garage kit is doing a better job of it. (Sorry, I can\'t resist having another dig at Mr. Castro.)
If the guy\'s a nice guy, I\'d probably just let it slide. If he\'s a tw*t, I\'d let him know that he needs to get over himself and wake up. After all, there\'s nothing like a good reality check to put your arse into gear, and motivate you to start working on really improving.
Shawn R. L.
New member
Reverand - I detach myself from the ongoing fights and such. HONESTLY, I\'m simply curious....REALLY - you bring up God, faith, religion and such with regularity. Be curious to hear the story behind that.
Hands of blue
New member
Would you tell to a child that a gift santa brought him/her is in fact bought by his/her parents and delivered by a guy from next door wearing a costume?
The difference is that a child will believe what you say. If an adult believes in god there is little change anything you say will change that. But if he is a nice guy he won\'t judge you by your beliefs and opinions. So I see no reason why you couldn\'t discuss the matter with him.
If the problem is just his belief that he is a special snowflake among mini painters I see no reason to point out that he is in the matter of fact pretty average painter. He will surely learn that on time anyway.
The difference is that a child will believe what you say. If an adult believes in god there is little change anything you say will change that. But if he is a nice guy he won\'t judge you by your beliefs and opinions. So I see no reason why you couldn\'t discuss the matter with him.
If the problem is just his belief that he is a special snowflake among mini painters I see no reason to point out that he is in the matter of fact pretty average painter. He will surely learn that on time anyway.
Infidel Castro
New member
Then start a thread on it Shawn
ScottRadom
Shogun of Saskatchewan
Spill! Details! About the gift person I mean.
Infidel Castro
New member
I think some folk have got me wrong. Whereas I might have asked the question in the first place, I\'m in no position to tell the person what I think, and as such I never will. I just wanted some debate on it. It\'s a wishy-washy subject, but in all fairness it\'s at least something to gas about. I\'m never going to pick the matter up with the person. I just found it a challenging point - to be saying what was said when the level of quality is below what I would expect to be Demon-winning is an odd stance.
Aye, it\'s all a bit rhetorical, but given the guff we quite often churn out (with much enjoyment I might add), a discussion about what I posed seems half normal to me.
It\'s very easy for folk to come across all philosophical when a subject veers towards perceived criticism, but a few of your responses are missing my stance somewhat - I\'ve no need to say anything to the person as I don\'t know them from Adam. I\'m just looking for a bit of discussion with my muckers on my favourite site...
Aye, it\'s all a bit rhetorical, but given the guff we quite often churn out (with much enjoyment I might add), a discussion about what I posed seems half normal to me.
It\'s very easy for folk to come across all philosophical when a subject veers towards perceived criticism, but a few of your responses are missing my stance somewhat - I\'ve no need to say anything to the person as I don\'t know them from Adam. I\'m just looking for a bit of discussion with my muckers on my favourite site...
Infidel Castro
New member
It ain\'t Castro! lol
ScottRadom
Shogun of Saskatchewan
Hey I\'ll gaff with ya! But you probably knew that.
I agree that it\'s frustrating when people talk about their level of talent and seem to associate a greater skill level to themselves then they deserve. It\'s the norm here locally! I\'m defo not the best brushman in my neighborhood but that\'s why I qualify all my statements on painting with things like \"I think...\", or \"I would try....\" instead of \"You should do what I do\" kind of stuff.
This place is full of great painters who ARE in a position to give instuctional advice, and they\'ve helped me loads. Even as we speak I\'ve gotten great OSL advice from some of the best in the biz, and that\'s helpful.
But I think Reverend what you and I agree on are the people of the less then inspired, but not completely without skill level (I lump myself in with the latter category) who really operate there painting persona with the attitude I might expect from a guy with a closet full of slayer swords. And in fact the best painters \'round here are the opposite, very humble, comlimentary, and friendly.
Also I agree that this is a great place to shoot the breeze, but c\'mon Rev., y\'didn\'t think you\'d get some heat when you bring up \"gift from God\"? You know better then that!lol
I agree that it\'s frustrating when people talk about their level of talent and seem to associate a greater skill level to themselves then they deserve. It\'s the norm here locally! I\'m defo not the best brushman in my neighborhood but that\'s why I qualify all my statements on painting with things like \"I think...\", or \"I would try....\" instead of \"You should do what I do\" kind of stuff.
This place is full of great painters who ARE in a position to give instuctional advice, and they\'ve helped me loads. Even as we speak I\'ve gotten great OSL advice from some of the best in the biz, and that\'s helpful.
But I think Reverend what you and I agree on are the people of the less then inspired, but not completely without skill level (I lump myself in with the latter category) who really operate there painting persona with the attitude I might expect from a guy with a closet full of slayer swords. And in fact the best painters \'round here are the opposite, very humble, comlimentary, and friendly.
Also I agree that this is a great place to shoot the breeze, but c\'mon Rev., y\'didn\'t think you\'d get some heat when you bring up \"gift from God\"? You know better then that!lol
EArkham
Necromancer
When someone says they have a \"Gift from God,\" it really isn\'t about the existence of gods or even their skill level, is it?
It\'s just about their own perceptions, and that\'s it. Whether they consider it humble (\"It\'s not my doing\"), arrogant (\"I\'m divinely inspired\"), trying to feel better about themselves (\"I\'m so lucky to have this ability\"), parroting an oft heard phrase without real thought (\"My mum said I had a gift, so I guess I do\"), or a dozen other ways of looking at it, saying that you have a \"gift\" is usually an expression of believing or wanting to believe that you\'re special or unique.
It isn\'t about what skill is required to call it a gift, but in trying to understand why a particular person would refer to an ability as a gift. How many different experiences in their life have contributed to the moment they begin thinking that what they have is a gift? What needs are they fulfilling by saying this?
Kep
It\'s just about their own perceptions, and that\'s it. Whether they consider it humble (\"It\'s not my doing\"), arrogant (\"I\'m divinely inspired\"), trying to feel better about themselves (\"I\'m so lucky to have this ability\"), parroting an oft heard phrase without real thought (\"My mum said I had a gift, so I guess I do\"), or a dozen other ways of looking at it, saying that you have a \"gift\" is usually an expression of believing or wanting to believe that you\'re special or unique.
It isn\'t about what skill is required to call it a gift, but in trying to understand why a particular person would refer to an ability as a gift. How many different experiences in their life have contributed to the moment they begin thinking that what they have is a gift? What needs are they fulfilling by saying this?
Kep
Infidel Castro
New member
You\'ve nailed it - it\'s about the perception. That\'s what I was interested by and what prompted me to raise the point.
Infidel Castro
New member
Aye, maybe! But why not? Let\'s get our sleeves rolled up and have a good old chat about it :innocent:
