GW water effects makes me a saaaad panda...

[OrkyDave]

I had a fantastic idea for a display piece using the Ltd edition Forgeworld Slaan magepriest, and having him relaxing in a pool of water... (well... Avecinnia had my fantastic idea first, with his superb giant gamesday finalist, But in true orky style I looted it!)

And in propper true orky style I bodged it up good and propper!!!:redface:

I had sent him a PM to ask what he had used and for any tips to using it, but unfortunatley have had no response (although to be fair I haven\'t noticed him around in the forums recently). So I went ahead and bought some GW water effects.

I may have well paid a tramp £12 to piss in a bottle of PVA for all the good it done.

I followed the instructions to the letter, only adding 1-2mm per day, and leaving it 24 hours and this is the piss poor results I got.

.

Even in these poor pics you can see how awful and cloudy this stuff is, It is totally not what I was expecting from a £12 product, and I could of achieved a better effect with watered down PVA.

Have decided to cut my losses and completley re do this as I can still salvage the slann (although I will have to lose the fish I sculpted and the obligitary boot at the bottom of the riverbed I hollowed out.)

Does anyone know what stuff Avecinnia used, and where I can get some?

 

[matty1001]

I would just leave it like that (like a murky base) then add more better stuff over the top. Woodland Scenics has some pretty rave reviews going for it.

 

[Ogrebane]

Ive only ever used PVA. I usually use a very very very very watered down blue, brown or green to give it a bit of color. Can you start again? would be a shame not to finish it now.

 

[demonherald]

The problem with that stuff is if you try to take it out of that tub you\'ll be pretty screwed..I\'d probably be inclined to leave it a good few days in a warm place to dry as thouroughly as possible ....
GW wet effect is pretty shite really..OK for doing small puddles etc but anything else forget it..I\'m not sure if the states version is different to our own I\'m sure something was mentioned at a meeting when it was due for release..

To do large blocks like aviciennas your best getting a resn of some sort...If you have a Hobbycraft near you they do a couple of good ones . A strong very smelly very dangerous one that gives a great effect.. My favourite ..The safest and cheapest and doesn\'t smell at all is found in the dry flowers section...it\'s used for setting arrangements ..Also used for making paperweights so very clear finish.. (sorry can\'t remember it\'s name.) I\'m at hobbycraft at the weekend so if you don\'t have one nearby let me pm me I\'d be happy o nip and get some for ya..

As for the building up process I have asked several people and most don\'t let you know and those that do are very guarded and have loads of different ways.
I find it best if you can get some plasticard or similar (preferrably clear ) cut it to a little more than the depth you need and cut enough to go round your piece in one bit...make nice clean folds by scoring for the corners but have the cut side facing outwards ( making sense it is 5.05 a.m).....
Now fasten this in place as tightly as possible with sellotape...Obviously important to avoid any gaps here.As an extra measure I build up plasticine right around and under the base this helps make a tighter seal.Place sellotape round the inside of the \"mould\" sticky side to the plastic...A final check for water tightness...(if you want to save a lot of pains later on fill with water and leave overnight ..if it spills you have a leak...doh....
Then off ou go with ya resin....Clear plastic is useful as you can then spend the first hour of curing fishing out air bubbles with a pin...or you can leave them.. just make sure you pour the resin slowly and avoid big air pockets.

also make sure you read theinstructions with the resin as some have different maximum depths as well as times before pouring another layer and shinkage..

hope that helps pal sorry it\'s a bit longwinded but it can be a tricky but cool looking effect.

 

[nightshade777]

Resin

Sorry to hear about the bum luck, but, one of the things that if you are into making larger resin pools, woodland senics water effects is awsome, but is costly. An alternative is two part casting resin, which comes in a can like paint thinner and stinks just as bad. Then you have to buy the catalist. The derections are pretty laid out, but still takes a bit of practice to use. As far as realisim, it it great, since it drys clear and can be tinted. The neatest feature is if when it is roughly 2/3 dry, you can rough up the surface to create small ripples and waves. Also whirlpools (which takes practice. Cost in CAD is roughly 15.00$. Found with the sculpy and mold building kits.

Good Luck!

Jeff

 

[No Such Agency]

Just a reminder to all to test any new product (esp. GW) before you do anything irreversible with it

 

[Talion]

We should have a special section, which states, what\'s good for what.

Or do we.........can\'t be arsed to look.

someone could test a new product and give thier results, it could then be added to a list.

Then Pinky we can do the same as usual and try to take over the world.

 

[james sequeira]

Ring GW and rant at them about how it screwed your project up, might be able to grab some replacement stuff.

 

[Wren]

I\'m sorry that your diorama has been affected this way, it\'s pretty cool and I love the boot and the other little touches. How long has it been since you poured the water? Is there any chance it\'s just not dry and the cloudiness will clear up? I\'d give it a week or two at least to see before I ripped it all apart.

My experience with Woodland Scenics Realistic Water is that it shrunk. A lot. It shrunk while drying, and then shrunk and shrunk some more in the year since I used it. Realistic Water is the pourable Woodland Scenics product, Water Effects comes out of the bottle looking like PVA and acting even thicker, and is intended for sculpting effects like waves and such, I don\'t think it\'s intended or would be easy to use for a big pool like this. Woodland Scenics also makes a product that starts as round pellets that you melt on the stove and then pour, which is probably pretty similar to the resins that others have been recommending for large areas like you\'re wanting to do.

 

[Trevor]

Leave it for a long time, it might clear up.

You want to use clear resin. I know a great source here in Oz, not sure about UK though.

 

[StarFyre]

well..a bit of experience

I have some experience with the woodland scenics water effects and realistic water, but I\'m not that good with either.

My engine of the gods used like 3 bottles of realistic water. I poured a bit each day until it reached the depth I wanted. As well, I mixed in some drops of ink. It turned out fairly well I think. My error was that the ink was too constant; should have had some more clear areas and some darker areas, etc to simulate a swamp better.

I did a test with a crap mini and at a low depth it dried clear but took longer than it stated. I left it for 2 days in between at a very low depth. The stuff was still soft after 24 hours..not sure why.

Water effects is basically thicker glue. I find it hard to sculpt.

One comment. I poured realistic water into a round wooden base Jeff (dragonforgedesign) made for me; for a sculpted dolphin I did for Shilpa. The pull of the drying realistic water on the wooden round base, caused it to crack!!!!

Also, if you pour too much, it\'s not that it stays cloudy (it won\'t) but it stays soft underneath and only the top will dry

Sanjay

 

[Dragon Forge Design]

Basically the material is crap..its basically clear glue that drys after you pour it. My suggestion to you is rull the diorama apart.. strip the paint off and start over.

For water I would suggest a clear resin. The type thats used for arts and crafts and wood working to clear coat objects with. its 2 parts, mixs 50-50 and drys clear. Its useually an acrylic base to it. Andrea makes a clear water 2 part kit I know that.

Also I would pour it in a container that the object can be removed from if thats your final goal. I would do a test first to make sure things will pop out when done.

Id ask Avecinnia what he did on his piece.

 

[Lemmingspawn]

I\'ve heard good things about the Envirotex Lite stuff. They use it on the hirst arts site for large areas like the one you\'re doing. And they don\'t do it in layers, they do it all at once.

http://www.hirstarts.com/tips17/tips17.html

 

[OrkyDave]

Thanks for the tips guys, I did PM Avecinna, but with no response so hence the thread.

Will try hobbycraft to get some 2 part resin and hope that works better!

Will just pry the slaan from his rock and re make another base, it was fairly straightforwardto do, and I intended to carefully break the finished pond from the tray when done.

Cheers for the tips guys, Will keep you posted with progress, although may not be for a month or so

 

[ralfmetal]

Hi try and find Crystal Clear made by Smooth On its a great 2 part resin that you can pour huge amounts of it and sets without shrinkage clear as glass.

 

[Orb]

I\'ve got the Andrea stuff..........not used it yet but David Rodriguez has used it (being an Andrea employee) and you can see it on his Robin Hood in the gallery and it looks very good indeed.

Got mine from Historex Agents

 

[Albert Moreto Font]

Andrea Artifitial water is BY VERY FAR the best artifitial water in the mini market, followed by Nimix, the pity of this second one is that it never really hardens, it stays like some sort of gel forever so you really can\'t touch it... but for filling inside a hole or something its just as good as andreas.

 

[Logan]

Originally posted by Lemmingspawn
I\'ve heard good things about the Envirotex Lite stuff. They use it on the hirst arts site for large areas like the one you\'re doing. And they don\'t do it in layers, they do it all at once.

http://www.hirstarts.com/tips17/tips17.html

I can second this stuff. I\'ve used it on loads of projects from small pools to waterfalls to huge (swimming) pools of blood.
You can source it in the UK as well and pour it all out in one go.

 

[DaN]

I have woodlance scenics water effects Clear, gel-like stuff. And while this dries lovely a clear, it also doesn\'t layer very well - and also once dry, if you accidentally leave anything on top, such as a brush, it can sink INTO the pool, and removing it leaves an impression (But this EVENTUALLY sets back smooth)

I also have the woodland scenics MOVING water effects - which looks EXACTLY like PVA, and sets completely clear - but can be manipulated quite well and you can build this up - but I wouldn\'t recommend using THIS for flat water as it costs more!!

 

[donga666]

Been in contact with Avicenna about this very same problem. (he\'s on \'Forum of Doom\' these days, on Heresy website...).

He used clear casting resin from www.Tiranti.co.uk (could be .com? Can\'t remember). They are based in London and are VERY good and helpful, (we use them at work) are great to order from and ask advice of.

BUT it will disolve Polystyrene (what \'plastic\' models are made of) and it gets HOT if poured in large amounts. If it is poured in thin layers the heat build up is not too bad.

I will be trying the Andrea or Deluxe productions Clear cast resin. They are epoxy based and will not get hot or dissolve Polystyrene.

Hope that helps ???