Help with washes

[JonG]

Hi all,

After another long hiatus from Coolmini I\'ve found myself getting back into 40K and am embarking on a grand army building project (Eldar + Chaos Space Marines).

Now my question for you all is regarding washes. I\'ve been painting for many years now but have never got on well with washes, preferring the control I get when manually highlighting up and shadowing with blending. However for my Emperor\'s Children Marines I thought I\'d see about laying a black lining wash over the white undercoated mini to help delineate the details before I embarked with the basecoating. Pre-lining it essentially.

Unfortunately the wash was a disaster and I suffered from serious tidemarks, despite adding some flow improver to the mix. I switched over to another mini and tried using a black ink instead of water-thinned Vallejo black and the same problem occurred. The final outcome is a bizarre inverse of the desired effect with the black/grey gathered in the open areas and white lines in the creases :|~

My suspicion is that I may be overloading the mini with the wash. When I first apply it it looks great with the wash all neatly pooled in the recesses, but as it dries I am saddened to see it spreading out and muddying (through capillary action if my high school science memory serves me).

So anyone got any ideas what I might be doing wrong, or any tips for successful washing?

 

[Avelorn]

Well. the easiest tip would be to try out the new GW washes as they tend not to leave tidemarks. Otherwise you will have to be more careful and try adding a tiny fraction of dishwashing liquid that will break the surface tension. If it\'s meant as a preshade so to speak it doesn\'t have to be that neat if you use a nice covering basecoat afterwards, like a foundation paint for example. Another tip would just to skip this step and use black primer instead with a good solid basecoat on top.

 

[JonG]

Thanks Avelorn. I did pick up a pot of GW Ogryn Flesh wash last week out of curiosity as I\'d heard some good things about them. I look forward to giving that a try, although I can\'t see I\'ll have much opportunity on these marines and Eldar!

I\'d still like to be able to understand what I\'m doing wrong with the black wash(es) I am using though so I have full control of colour choice in the future. I did use a flow improver - Windsor & Newton which is a surfactant (more science!) and performs the same function as dishwashing liquid I believe. I tried different ratios of that in the mix but it didn\'t make much difference.

As for basecoating, I did consider painting up from a black for once but I tend to prefer a white basecoat as it really brings out the details and colours go on that much more easily.

I shall have a try tonight with a less loaded brush to see if that helps.

 

[Ritual]

Originally posted by JonG
I shall have a try tonight with a less loaded brush to see if that helps.

Using less paint, i.e. less loaded brush, solves many problems and gives you increased control. You may have to repeat things to get the desired effect, but you avoid a lot of undesired effects as well.

 

[CreganTur]

Originally posted by Ritual

Originally posted by JonG
I shall have a try tonight with a less loaded brush to see if that helps.

Using less paint, i.e. less loaded brush, solves many problems and gives you increased control. You may have to repeat things to get the desired effect, but you avoid a lot of undesired effects as well.

^This.

I\'ve found that overloading my brush with too much wash or ink always causes pools where I don\'t want them.

I have found that if you do get a pool somewhere where you don\'t want it, you can unload your brush (rub it on a paper towel) and then go back over the area to soak up the excess. Then wet your brush with a bit of pure water and brush over the area to smooth out the pigment that\'s left behind.

 

[JonG]

Cheers guys. I\'ll play around tonight and let you know how I get on.

 

[JonG]

I tried on a fresh mini using less wash on the brush and also some different consistencies of paint, but sadly the results were never quite what I was after.

Although the results were better and certainly less messy, I wasn\'t able to get minimal coverage on the raised areas with most coverage in the recesses. I tended to get a fairly even spread, more like a glaze I guess.

I went back and re-watched a section of the Jen Haley Miniature Mentor DVD in which she does exactly what I\'m trying to do and she puts together a mix of Reaper Master Brown Liner + Matt Medium (I think) + water. With a single pass of the brush over a white undercoated mini she gets a slight darkening across all areas but nice black/brown lines delineating all the details.

I\'ll pick up a dark wash from GW today and see if that has the right consistency.

 

[Verm1s]

Reading your posts, I\'d personally say your problem is a white SM with black wash. I can\'t easily imagine sharply defined black panel lines with a minimum of mess over the white. It\'d show up too easily! I\'d even say the sharp edges of the armour would prevent excess wash being sucked into the lines with the rest. Did Jen use a space marine too?

You mention matt medium. I accidentally stumbled upon great, smooth \'magic\' washes before I knew what a magic wash was, using Daler-Rowney matt glaze medium and tension breaker (D-R before, Klear/Future now). Although the results aren\'t so hot if I use them individually, for some reason. I often got patchiness and tide marks with tension breaker too. In my experience there\'s only so much it can do when washes get thin enough.
The D-R gel medium does it\'s usual thing with acrylic paints: it helps increase transparency but also maintains a certain amount of body. That\'s the trick, I think, in tandem with tension breaker; although I\'ve no idea how to explain it.

The kind of washes I make up are a little thicker than GW washes (I like those too, for the colours and convenience); and with the right amount of ingredients and fiddling, usually have even less problems with tidemarks if I do say so meself.

And yes, I agree with the overloaded brush comments.