Here we go again...Promo figures and the need for reprinting

[markallanreynolds]

This has been up for discussion a ton of times since the original Kickstarter, but I still think it is time for Guillotine Games and CMON to reconsider their approach toward NOT reprinting the original promo figures for Zombicide. While I understand their decision and their wanting to remain true to their word, there is still many ways around reprinting the promos and not taking anything away from the original backers - their figures were exclusive in their particular color and style. Why not recast them in a solid grey uniform color that would designate them as second editions (thus not taking away anything from the original figures) - this would give all the folks who missed out on the first (or second Kickstarter for that matter) promos a chance to have figures that match their cards and would give us the option to paint them to their proper color or leave them as is. I don't see how the original Kickstarter backers could have a problem with this - their figures are still original and exclusive. Their only gripe would be how they could no longer sell them on eBay for a small fortune (which I'm sure wasn't CMON or GG's intent when they made the figures exclusive to begin with). And - yes - I use proxies. But no matter how close some of them are, the majority are way off. And for those who will say: grow up, they're only little figures...that's the whole point. All of this is only about a game - for all you original backers who demand CMON and GG stay true to their word...how much of your life would be ruined if they reproduced them? I'm betting not much, so let us join in on the fun, too

 

[Scorpion0x17]

Really?

Again?

Which part of the following statements do you not understand?

Hello. The 26th of November we posted our official answer that hasn't changed and will not change: "To all the people asking us if these will be available to the market... The answer is no.
These figures were conceived for the Kickstarter action and for Kickstarter backers only. We cannot betray our word and lack of respect to our backers.
Dashboards will be free for download, so you can play with a proxy... I know many of you won't be happy, but I hope you understand our choice (and look from this perspective our choice: we are giving up good potential sales because we value more our word than some easy money...)
Many new figures are coming in future offers...
We will start the production of these promo figures in few weeks... ".
We made nice good looking boxes because we value our customers and we think they will appreciate a nice box. Set#1 because in the future we will have other sets. At least we hope so. During convention it is possible that few figures will be available in limited run. We produced with a security margin of 5%.
Nick, Cholo and Dave were not limited to Kickstarter only, but also to some marketing action with Ravage France and Edge in Spain and France. But they are very limited too.
we know this decision could upset some gamers, but our word is our word and we will not change it for some easy money.

all the promos are exclusive, they will never be sold retail, online, etc.

 

[markallanreynolds]

Really?

Again?

Which part of the following statements do you not understand?

Which part of my post do you not understand??? I can read (and have read) what their position was/is: I'm suggesting an alternative to that situation. No one in life should ever be locked into a NEVER means NEVER situation. When they made those decisions, things were certainly a lot different than the current status of their franchise. So keep your snooty and demeaning comments to a minimum.

 

[donnbobhardy]

I don't think he's trying to be snooty. It's just that this argument has been beaten into the ground several times. Your proposed solution has been made numerous times. I'm on your side on this. I'd like to have them, too. But I don't think it's ever going to happen and bringing it up again is just going to make people on both sides of the argument angry.

 

[grefven]

I don't agree with releasing them in a different colour or whatever of the "original figure". But I do easily support the idea of a general release of the characters but with an alternate pose.

 

[Scorpion0x17]

Which part of my post do you not understand??? I can read (and have read) what their position was/is: I'm suggesting an alternative to that situation. No one in life should ever be locked into a NEVER means NEVER situation. When they made those decisions, things were certainly a lot different than the current status of their franchise. So keep your snooty and demeaning comments to a minimum.

Dude, those quotes are from Guillotine Games - you know, the people behind the game - no one is forcing them to stick to their position - they've made a decision and they're sticking to it - "suggesting an alternative to that situation" (a solution which, by the way, has been suggested numerous times by several other people already) is pointless, because they're clearly not going to change their minds.

Oh and, by the way, it has apparently been stated by someone who works for CoolMiniOrNot (you know, the people that publish the game) that the molds for all the season 1 promos have been broken up - and I'm sure they'll be doing the same for the season 2 ones too.

And, how was the "state of their franchise" "certainly a lot different", exactly?

Season 1 was already a sell out success. They already knew the Season 2 KS would almost certainly go (if not already had gone) through the roof. Just as I'm sure they know that Season 2 will almost certainly be as big a sell out success as Season 1 was, and still is.

Nothing that is likely to make them change their minds has changed one iota.

Maybe if Season 1 hadn't sold out almost as fast as CMON could ship it in, maybe if the Season 2 KS hadn't blown all of CMONs previous KSs clean out the water, maybe if CMONs subsequent KS had done better than it, and maybe, just maybe, if Season 2 wasn't still the most successful board game KS yet, then, perhaps, even if only one of those things had been true, then you might, just might, have had a point.

Seriously, are you familiar with the term "flogging a dead horse"?

This horse is so long dead there's little left but skin and bone.

I'm not saying this to be snooty and/or demeaning, I'm saying this because this discussion clearly and obviously pointless, and it always was.

And, you know what, I would be disappointed that they didn't stick to their promise, but ultimately it really wouldn't bother me a great deal if they did go back on their word, but the thing is it's pretty damn clear that that just ain't going to happen.

How much would it ruin your life if they never re-released them? Move on and have fun with what you've got.

 

[markallanreynolds]

See the problem with all the words you made me waste my time reading are simply: you are not them. Would it not be a rue awakening for you and others like you if they announced tomorrow they were going to reprint all of the figures? I have great respect for both CMON and Guillotine Games - they have treated me fair on a personal level and given me endless of hours of fun on a gamers level - and while I respect their decision, it doesn't mean I won't drop by from time to time to try and change their minds. If they won't, they won't. But all your advice and lecturing isn't going to stop me from asking I also seriously doubt any modes were broken - I've worked in manufacturing for 16 years and companies tend to keep everything...but if they are, then I guess you win. @grefven: that's another approach I wouldn't mind seeing, either.

 

[Scorpion0x17]

I also seriously doubt any modes were broken - I've worked in manufacturing for 16 years and companies tend to keep everything...but if they are, then I guess you win.

I think if they hadn't had people keep on "dropping by from time to time to try and change their minds" then they most probably wouldn't have broken them. And, admittedly, I've not seen or heard it directly from either GG or CMON. But I suspect it is absolutely true.

Also, it's not about anyone winning, and yes, I am indeed not them, but both GG and CMON have stated the same thing over and over again, in ever more clear and unambiguous ways. They're both putting the reputations of their entire companies on the line, and I don't think they would do that at all lightly. Especially CMON who have been around for some time and have built a solid reputation in the mini-painting and -gaming worlds.

 

[Shoogoo]

Not gonna happen, sorry.

If it's that important to you to have all of them, Ebay is the only viable solution. Prices have dropped because people realized they'll get approximatively a hundred survivors (rounded up) with Season 2 kickstarter. And if you missed that one too, well.. I don't know what to tell you, even my neighbor heard about it, and it wasn't me who told him. And he doesn't even like board games.

 

[Scorpion0x17]

...Season 2 kickstarter. And if you missed that one too, well.. I don't know what to tell you, even my neighbor heard about it, and it wasn't me who told him. And he doesn't even like board games.

But it probably was your wife that told him.

(no implications implied by that )

 

[markallanreynolds]

It's "not that important" to me...I stated that I use Proxies. And if you take into account the figure made over in France with a 1500 piece run (Mr. Phal I think he's called) I don't expect to have a complete run. I just think that it would be great for all the Zombicide players who missed the first, second, or whatever Kickstarter to have the opportunity to play with figures that match their cards. The only thing the original Kickstarter buyers did "special" was to hear of it first - almost everyone I know that plays Zombicide bought the game after the original Kickstarter...had they known about it when it first started, they too would have all the promos. I, personally, can't say that. I bought into Season 2 but did not get all the extra promos...funds were tight and I decided I would rather have the additional Walk of the Dead boxes and such instead of a few extra characters. Will that stop me from asking CMON and GG from making more? Probably not

 

[markallanreynolds]

One last thing (at least until my next attempt to sway CMON & GG): If there are any Stephen King fans on here, do you remember when The Dark Tower: The Gunslinger was originally released by Donald M. Grant, Publisher in an extremely low 1st printing? I do, I bought it. For years after it had sold out (with a small second printing from Grant), Mr. King swore he would never reprint it. He gave multiple reasons and I firmly believe he believed in those reasons and stood behind them. Ultimately, however, he changed his mind. It didn't happen overnight and his faithful readers had to wait patiently for this to happen, but in the long run they finally were able to own the book. Will CMON or GG ever change their minds and reprint the promos - only they know and only time will tell. They may say "No" today but we have the right to want and hope they will say "Yes" tomorrow. That's all. Now it's back to killing zombies!!!

 

[Shoogoo]

But it probably was your wife that told him.

(no implications implied by that )

lol

@mark: reprinting a book years after is easier (and hardly comparable) to recasting miniatures. The mold, even if it hasn't been broken like GG said, is altered (and would eventually break anyway) and they'd have to make new ones. I'm an avid collector and have all kind of LEs and CEs and I have never EVER seen an exclusive item being remade.

 

[Yuggoth]

It's "not that important" to me...I stated that I use Proxies. And if you take into account the figure made over in France with a 1500 piece run (Mr. Phal I think he's called) I don't expect to have a complete run. I just think that it would be great for all the Zombicide players who missed the first, second, or whatever Kickstarter to have the opportunity to play with figures that match their cards. The only thing the original Kickstarter buyers did "special" was to hear of it first - almost everyone I know that plays Zombicide bought the game after the original Kickstarter...had they known about it when it first started, they too would have all the promos. I, personally, can't say that. I bought into Season 2 but did not get all the extra promos...funds were tight and I decided I would rather have the additional Walk of the Dead boxes and such instead of a few extra characters. Will that stop me from asking CMON and GG from making more? Probably not

Thats just wrong. Like with every kickstarter, those original backers gave money for month in advance without seeing the final result and thus took a considerable risk. The promos are the reward for their faith and patients and recasting them would be wrong on so many levels I cant even begin to fathom this idea.
Doing them in "another colour" is not going to change the fact that the original backers trust is abused. That would just be as stupid as WOTCs constant tinkering with the reserved list of their CCG.
Do I go out and demand recasts of limited runs of McVeys or Freebooters? Do you go and demand that Ford should restart production of the classic gran torinos because you wherent there when they sold the original run? No? Then what makes you think you are entitled to demand such a thing in this case?

 

[MAXXxxx]

Would it not be a rue awakening for you and others like you if they announced tomorrow they were going to reprint all of the figures?

rude awakening? not really, at that point they'd just have broken their original promise.
would I be pissed enough to stop buying/supporting anything GG/CMON? most likely

I really value companies that hold to their promises even if I have to miss out some of their products because of that (like some of the missing Freebooter limiteds / McVey minis).


funny, but the above holds for minis that are simply remade, irrelevant of color or material. If they'd do alternative poses it wouldn't bother me. Alternative pose is a new figure from my pov.

 

[markallanreynolds]

Well I thought I was done Hey guys, I am a writer of fiction so be aware I CAN read what you're saying without you having to explain it to me I totally agree that reprinting a book doesn't compare to re-casting a figure - that wasn't my comparison. I was pointing out that Stephen King said he would never allow the book to be reprinted. Over time he changed his point of view on the subject and did. That's all. @Yuggoth: Your point is one I do understand (because we all know backing some Kickstarters really are a leap of faith!) but I still don't agree with your assessment that changing the color doesn't change the figure. If you have a green Nick then we all know you was there from the beginning and we admire your dedication - if I have a pink Nick then we all know I went down to the local game shop and plopped down a few dollars. I just don't see how some of you guys (or gals) on here see that as the same thing. It's just a difference of opinion. And I have never DEMANDED anything. If that was my position, then I would be telling CMON and GG to either reprint or they'll never see any of my money again. Since I'm waiting on my Season 2 stuff, that's hardly the case. CMON and GG are two of my favorite game companies (GG because of Zombicide and the fact they do post extra content for the game and CMON I use to buy figures and they have been extremely nice to me since I've become a customer of theirs). One more thing to think about: as all of you guys claim, people have been on here complaining and griping about CMON not reprinting the promos but they continue to back the company and buy new product...but from what I seem to read, more often or not, you original backers will drop them cold turkey if they change their mind. Which is the more dedicated group?

 

[Shoogoo]

Just to be clear, I personnaly wouldn't give a damn if they decided to give those promos (even for free! Christmas early!). But my position isn't shared by everyone. It sure would help my friend stop being jealous at all my shinies. I told them to back the damn thing, but they never listen.

But it's not gonna happen. It just won't.

Also, this forum is a PoS, and CMON should feel bad. I just lost my reply for no good reason.

 

[joshuar56]

I backed season 2, I even backed extra to sell off, but I would still have no problem with CMoN offering them for general retail. I have no problem with everyone having the chance to get more out of the game. To get an opportunity to play the complete game. If you have a problem with that, you probably aren't a very good person IMO. LEs are bad for the community in many different ways. They split it into the haves and have nots, and they limit the community's growth potential. People who support their LGS rather than the KS shouldn't be punished by a blackmailing CMoN...

 

[joshuar56]

Also, the more people who post about this, and make topics about it the better. Hopefully it will help CMoN to do the right thing.

 

[donnbobhardy]

Also, the more people who post about this, and make topics about it the better. Hopefully it will help CMoN to do the right thing.

Spoken like somebody who didn't live through the drama of the KS. Again, I am in complete agreement that there should be a way for us to acquire the promo survivors without resorting to ebay, but they've made their decision. They have a valid reason for sticking with their decision. Peppering them with whiny emails/posts/etc is not likely to change their minds. They've already (supposedly) retaliated once by destroying the molds for these figures. Do we really want to annoy them enough to make them do something worse?

Let's just live with their decision and move on. As the original poster stated, there are proxies that are available and work perfectly fine.