Is my tutor a tit?
- Thread starter darkartminiatures
- Start date
It\'s pretty sad we\'ve come to this, but in a way you\'re right, Dave.
There are a lot of those so called \'artist\' that , being confronted to a total lack of talent, will do all kind of crap to crate a reaction. Then some socialite artist that veers some deep un-assumed frustration will call it art cause it\'s not, but it feels right with his hatred of life and humanity.
then just sooo many people will say \" Pfff, you just don\'t understand.\" because it is trendy and they want to sound like they know something about something.
And it goes on like that...
In a way, art is often just ego and ichors spread on a flat surface, but I will still call miniature painting art, cause I think Art belongs to the Artist and those that appreciate it, not to a bunch of egomaniac socialites that hate people.
Not going to reply on the \"Artist\" debate here, other than to say there are \"Artists\" and there are folks who\'ll foolishly pay to raise the status of said \"Artist\". If you really want to pay to try to figure out some hidden meaning, be my guest.
But as for the Tutor... either he/she is a real twit ... or... he/she was just doing their job. They might not have any cirriculum or any means with which to fully evaluate the work you did. It didn\'t follow established guidelines for grading. It might be great work, but if they can\'t grade it based on the guidelines they\'ve been handed, you\'re toast.
Ask for their opinions of your pieces outside of class if you want honest opinions.
If you want to make the grade, you have to do the dance. Miniatures and models, when not in a dedicated class, is viewed as a hobby. Period. No matter how much work goes into them.
At best, it might apply to Commercial Art, but definitely not \"Fine Art\".
It almost sounds to me like you didn\'t necessarily follow the cirriculum they had outlined and now have very little to grade (no pun intended). If I have a dozen themed paintings and large sculptures in a portfolio and you have a dozen tiny miniatures... who do you think will get the grade?
If I was your tutor, I\'d be a bit upset too. You spent quite a bit of time on 12-13 tiny models and didn\'t follow what was laid out for you. It\'s their class, it\'s their cirriculum, if you don\'t want to abide by it, don\'t bother with the class.
Painting them white might actually help you. Although YOU think they look better in green, a nice primer will help the details show much better (might also show the flaws too...).
But as for the Tutor... either he/she is a real twit ... or... he/she was just doing their job. They might not have any cirriculum or any means with which to fully evaluate the work you did. It didn\'t follow established guidelines for grading. It might be great work, but if they can\'t grade it based on the guidelines they\'ve been handed, you\'re toast.
Ask for their opinions of your pieces outside of class if you want honest opinions.
If you want to make the grade, you have to do the dance. Miniatures and models, when not in a dedicated class, is viewed as a hobby. Period. No matter how much work goes into them.
At best, it might apply to Commercial Art, but definitely not \"Fine Art\".
It almost sounds to me like you didn\'t necessarily follow the cirriculum they had outlined and now have very little to grade (no pun intended). If I have a dozen themed paintings and large sculptures in a portfolio and you have a dozen tiny miniatures... who do you think will get the grade?
If I was your tutor, I\'d be a bit upset too. You spent quite a bit of time on 12-13 tiny models and didn\'t follow what was laid out for you. It\'s their class, it\'s their cirriculum, if you don\'t want to abide by it, don\'t bother with the class.
Painting them white might actually help you. Although YOU think they look better in green, a nice primer will help the details show much better (might also show the flaws too...).
On what Evil Dave said: we recently had a Taiji Ball Qigong session with Master Yang. He was talking about simplicity, and how the most difficult things are often the most simple. While I agreed with him completely for the most part, he got me thinking when he compared simplicity to Chinese calligraphy. He said that the most complex characters are the easiest to do, and that the most difficult thing to do was a straight line. He said it was more difficult to express emotion and feeling in a single straight line than in a complex character.
The more I think about it though, the more I\'m inclined to agree with him - a straight line offers less to the calligrapher than does an entire character. However, I\'m no artist. I far prefer Turner\'s paintings over any modern day Deco d\'Shite, Neo-Enema or Post-Gastro styles.
As for your tutor, darkart, is he blue? Does he have wings, and when he talks does he chirp a lot? Or does his chin just remind you of a pair of the dangly things?
The more I think about it though, the more I\'m inclined to agree with him - a straight line offers less to the calligrapher than does an entire character. However, I\'m no artist. I far prefer Turner\'s paintings over any modern day Deco d\'Shite, Neo-Enema or Post-Gastro styles.
As for your tutor, darkart, is he blue? Does he have wings, and when he talks does he chirp a lot? Or does his chin just remind you of a pair of the dangly things?
cdukino
Member
This sure brings back memories about my experiences at my school. To damn reconisable. Fantasy apparently is no art no matter how well done it is an how big the skill involved is. Anthing outside the narrow viewpoints of the artteachters (read what they do and how they think art should be) is per defination wrong. And IF you try adjusting to what they think they want you to do... you get your lowest grade ever for your exam as they think (wrongly I might add) you didn\'t put anything of yourself in it (which you apparently aren\'t allowed to either if \" you is not them\" ). Discussions and protest is futile, the system is f**cked... So I decided I\'m not an artist like they try to make of people but an illustrator and mini sculptor. Pretty much everything I know I teached myself anyway.
So I decided art-teachers (myself (and a few other exceptions) not included ofcourse as officially I\'m a certified one now) are a complete different brand of people, so they are forgiven, they can\'t help it, they are indoctrinated by the bla-bla-bla-of-higher-arts-and-prejudice.
So I decided art-teachers (myself (and a few other exceptions) not included ofcourse as officially I\'m a certified one now) are a complete different brand of people, so they are forgiven, they can\'t help it, they are indoctrinated by the bla-bla-bla-of-higher-arts-and-prejudice.
Legacy Account
Active member
My god, there\'s some bollocks being spouted in this thread.
The reason most art students get poor marks is usually because their work is either shite or non existent....
The reason most art students get poor marks is usually because their work is either shite or non existent....
RedSevenBlue
New member
Originally posted by Spacemunkie
My god, there\'s some bollocks being spouted in this thread.
The reason most art students get poor marks is usually because their work is either shite or non existent....
In my art class, you\'d better not breathe, you might swallow some art. lol
\"Art\" is subjective.
I can\'t understand how you would be able to teach such a subjective thing.
Art history, sure.
Different art styles, sure.
Art itself, I\'m not so sure.
I, myself appreciate much art for the work put into it.
That is probably why I consider abstract painting rubbish, yet consider abstract sculpture art.
I can\'t understand how you would be able to teach such a subjective thing.
Art history, sure.
Different art styles, sure.
Art itself, I\'m not so sure.
I, myself appreciate much art for the work put into it.
That is probably why I consider abstract painting rubbish, yet consider abstract sculpture art.
RedSevenBlue
New member
EvilDave, your signature makes you seem like the G-Man from Half-Life 2, do you speak in real like with pauses in between words, like this
\"Rise and Shine Mr.Freeman, Rise..and Shine. Not to imply you have been sleeping..on the job\"
\"Rise and Shine Mr.Freeman, Rise..and Shine. Not to imply you have been sleeping..on the job\"
as you say you are going to have a hard time trying to get anything vaguely fantasy related to get good press in a fine arts course.
essentially you have to decide which is the payoff.
do you:
go with the teachers comments and make the changes and present it their way (sometimes there is a certain code of how \"this art\" is supposed to be presented)
or
say stuff it and get the mediocre grade, and find out its use for you.
unfortunately they are placing a grade on a subjective field. If you ever choose to follow the art path then the actual grade you get is later irrelevant. if you are doing the course to get a high scoring qualifaction that you need to get a job somewhere.........then i\'d start thinking about changing stuff.
i don\'t think your tutor is a tit. i think he hasn\'t understood what you are doing and the connection that rest of us hold to green stuff (to classically trained sculptors it has an extremely low reputation and a weird colour)
i don\'t think your lack of studio attendance has helped either. Maybe there were times that he wanted to chat with you other than consultations about where the project was going.
sometimes the experience of tutors does actually hold ground. but you have to decide whether his suggestions are valid, or if not .....tell him why they are not .
if you think something looks better a certain way, or can be done....then explain it to him, don\'t just rubbish his opinions, sometimes they can be very helpful in that they challenge your prejudices and force you to react this way about your work.
essentially you have to decide which is the payoff.
do you:
go with the teachers comments and make the changes and present it their way (sometimes there is a certain code of how \"this art\" is supposed to be presented)
or
say stuff it and get the mediocre grade, and find out its use for you.
unfortunately they are placing a grade on a subjective field. If you ever choose to follow the art path then the actual grade you get is later irrelevant. if you are doing the course to get a high scoring qualifaction that you need to get a job somewhere.........then i\'d start thinking about changing stuff.
i don\'t think your tutor is a tit. i think he hasn\'t understood what you are doing and the connection that rest of us hold to green stuff (to classically trained sculptors it has an extremely low reputation and a weird colour)
i don\'t think your lack of studio attendance has helped either. Maybe there were times that he wanted to chat with you other than consultations about where the project was going.
sometimes the experience of tutors does actually hold ground. but you have to decide whether his suggestions are valid, or if not .....tell him why they are not .
if you think something looks better a certain way, or can be done....then explain it to him, don\'t just rubbish his opinions, sometimes they can be very helpful in that they challenge your prejudices and force you to react this way about your work.
darkartminiatures
New member
@ Deadite: I talked to all of my tutors at the start of the year in which they accepted what i proposed to work on so its not that i haven\'t strayed away from the guidelines at all. The problem is that the one in particular thinks i haven\'t done enough though i clearly have done more than others. No reference of fantasy or sci fi is seen in my coursework.
Miniatures is viewed as a hobby like you say but sculpting is art and size should not matter at all. The chapman brothers \'Disasters of war\' proves that (like them or not).
If you had paintings and i had small scale sculptures I\'d expect both to pass if they was good enough and having looked at other students work it wouldn\'t be the same amount that you would be comparing... Most have 5 paintings at the most. If i had 13 small scale portrait sculptures, some in the style of famous artists (to keep folks happy) and you had 5 paintings that in some cases looked under-worked who do you think would get the grade? Size doesn\'t matter.....that’s what my tutor’s problem is. . As for evaluating my work, well I don’t think it takes much understanding on sculpting to realise that it takes effort, time and patience in order to create something like that. This is something he should understand.
Personally i feel that they look more pleasing if they were left green. I have seen enough white primed minsi to know what they would look like and i feel they would just lose some of the qualities that GS has that I like. Thanks for your input
@Medved: My tutors comments was that he would “like to see 200 of these little things” So theres not much chance of me doing that in a month
I agree that my lack of studio attendance may not look too well but the problem was the actual quantity. I do go to my studio but not as often as most as I can get more done at home. He has always let me carry on with my projects when ever I have talked to him so the subjects are not the problem. Your right he does not understand and that’s what I find the problem is. Since starting this course I have taken in nearly everything that has been taught to me and accepted all forms of art for what is it. I now like A LOT of stuff that I wouldn’t piss on if it was one fire before I started this course. (I can see a lynch mob at my door) and what I don’t like as a third year student is that I can see my tutor can’t understand that bigger doesn’t mean more. It’s just silly. In all honesty I have never rubbished his opinions until now and that’s down to his closed-mindedness. I have learnt to embrace all forms of art…..why can’t he?
Thanks folks for your views on this
Miniatures is viewed as a hobby like you say but sculpting is art and size should not matter at all. The chapman brothers \'Disasters of war\' proves that (like them or not).
If you had paintings and i had small scale sculptures I\'d expect both to pass if they was good enough and having looked at other students work it wouldn\'t be the same amount that you would be comparing... Most have 5 paintings at the most. If i had 13 small scale portrait sculptures, some in the style of famous artists (to keep folks happy) and you had 5 paintings that in some cases looked under-worked who do you think would get the grade? Size doesn\'t matter.....that’s what my tutor’s problem is. . As for evaluating my work, well I don’t think it takes much understanding on sculpting to realise that it takes effort, time and patience in order to create something like that. This is something he should understand.
Personally i feel that they look more pleasing if they were left green. I have seen enough white primed minsi to know what they would look like and i feel they would just lose some of the qualities that GS has that I like. Thanks for your input
@Medved: My tutors comments was that he would “like to see 200 of these little things” So theres not much chance of me doing that in a month
I agree that my lack of studio attendance may not look too well but the problem was the actual quantity. I do go to my studio but not as often as most as I can get more done at home. He has always let me carry on with my projects when ever I have talked to him so the subjects are not the problem. Your right he does not understand and that’s what I find the problem is. Since starting this course I have taken in nearly everything that has been taught to me and accepted all forms of art for what is it. I now like A LOT of stuff that I wouldn’t piss on if it was one fire before I started this course. (I can see a lynch mob at my door) and what I don’t like as a third year student is that I can see my tutor can’t understand that bigger doesn’t mean more. It’s just silly. In all honesty I have never rubbished his opinions until now and that’s down to his closed-mindedness. I have learnt to embrace all forms of art…..why can’t he?
Thanks folks for your views on this
No Such Agency
New member
If your sculptures did not fall under the umbrella of the course in either theme or technique, you may have goofed. I think art school is supposed to teach you all the stuffy conformist stuff before you strike out on your own tack.... and I think it also gives you a stodgy, unfair art establishment to rebel against. All the best art was that which pissed all over the norm, as it were. I bet Mondrian could draw and paint \"classically\", he just chose to reject that and paint coloured squares and lines
Cindy\'s post reminds me of the girl who works at the gaming store here saying to me \"I tried to work \'this stuff\' into my school art but it didn\'t go over very well.\" So you are hardly alone in being misunderstood. I don\'t know what to say, except this:
1. Tintoretto, \"St. George and the Dragon\" c. 1555
2. Boris Vallejo, \"Dragon Slayer\", late 20th century
Cindy\'s post reminds me of the girl who works at the gaming store here saying to me \"I tried to work \'this stuff\' into my school art but it didn\'t go over very well.\" So you are hardly alone in being misunderstood. I don\'t know what to say, except this:
1. Tintoretto, \"St. George and the Dragon\" c. 1555
2. Boris Vallejo, \"Dragon Slayer\", late 20th century
darkartminiatures
New member
I love Boris well...not that way
All i can say is that he cannot evaluate my work and i can only hope that the examiners can.
I left my fantasy head at home after the first year and its kept here nice and safe.
whooaa check out my post count
well...not that way All i can say is that he cannot evaluate my work and i can only hope that the examiners can.
I left my fantasy head at home after the first year and its kept here nice and safe.
whooaa check out my post count
Shawn R. L.
New member
Boris, to me, is one who is \'technically brilliant\' but his stuff always looks posed, void of motion and emotion. Frazetta on the other hand, his stuff had life, serious emotion, and movement. It had a rougher, more painterly look that had BALLS.
Sand Rat
New member
All this reminds me of a debate I had with an education professor back when I was thinking of being a teacher -
The professor was of the \"students are stupid\" school of thought, and I\'ve always been of the \"teachers make students stupid\" school of thought.
Needless to say he\'s still a professor, I never got my teaching certificate, and work in a combat zone now. But that was a decision I made after reviewing the facts and what I was going to face for the next 35 years at the time - an ongoing argument with the powers that be that challenging students to learn was a teachers job.
I made the decision that Sysiphis was not a good role model.
The professor was of the \"students are stupid\" school of thought, and I\'ve always been of the \"teachers make students stupid\" school of thought.
Needless to say he\'s still a professor, I never got my teaching certificate, and work in a combat zone now. But that was a decision I made after reviewing the facts and what I was going to face for the next 35 years at the time - an ongoing argument with the powers that be that challenging students to learn was a teachers job.
I made the decision that Sysiphis was not a good role model.
Ebonbuddha
Active member
I was thinking...\"in my mouth\". But that is a whole new can of beans.lol
