Khonner's WIP

Bailey03

Well-known member
I know that can be frustrating. Competition was very stiff at the Crystal Brush.

You're on the right track and your pieces are definitely getting better. The areas I'd say you should continue to work on shadow/highlight placement, increasing contrast, and smooth blends. It's not the kind of stuff that you can master on a single project, but stuff that gets better slowly over a number of projects.

Shadow and highlight placement, zenithal lighting, can also be described by the stop sign rule. Here's an excerpt from Shep Paine's book discussing the idea. Correct and consistent placement of shadows/highlights plays a major part in the realism of your end result. Your work is getting there but keep working on the light/dark placement.
stopsign.jpg



Here's a look at some of my past work and progress. This first piece is a 75mm figure I did back in 2010. You can see that I've got some light/dark variation in the blues, but the contrast is low and the placement doesn't really show the light source.
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Jump forward 2 years and here is a similar project, though 54mm in size. We're starting to see more light/dark contrast (although there could be a lot more). Whereas on the last figure it was hard to tell if it was really there, this time there is definite difference on the pants and coat. I was also getting better at placing the shadows and highlights correctly on the folds. But, on other spots like the red sash, shading/highlighting is barely noticeable. The face has some, but is also a little flat.
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6 months later I did this 54mm Napoleonic figure. Focus on the green coat, shadow/highlight placement is better and contrast is increasing (though still less than what follows). The shadows on the face, in the cheeks and eyes are also better.
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This is a piece about a year later, in 2013. Compare the contrast on the back of the coat. The range from light to dark is much bigger than the previous piece. Same with the pants, even though they are white there is still decent contrast. He's got variation in the level of highlight/shadow corresponding to the stop sign rule.
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And here is one from a few months ago. Again the contrast has been increased from the last one. Not only in the main color, but more in the details like the fold backs on the rear of the coat too. I then went on to add weathering to him for increased realism, but left it out of the photo so you could better see the original paint.
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And here's a closer look at some of the details. This is a 75mm piece, so more room to work. First image is just the base coat over primer so you have a reference. The normal lighting gives you some idea of where the shadow and highlight location should be.
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And here is the painted version. Notice how much deeper the shadows are now and how much lighter the highlights. This close up you can also see the transitions and blends better. While not perfect, it is still difficult to see where one shade goes into the next.
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You can also look at other stuff like what colors to use for highlighting and shading (using the color wheel, cool/warm variation, etc), glazes for subtle variation, weathering, basework, etc. But that is more fine level adjustments. Keep that in mind but really focus on pushing the contrast, picking the highlight/shadow locations based on the primary light source, and keeping those blends smooth. Increasing contrast and keeping blends smooth are tough to balance.

Hopefully these series of past projects helps you see the progression and how each builds and improves on the last. For you work, like Eldric, you can go further with the shadows on the arms to up the contrast and help define those shapes. The shadows on his clothing have decent contrast, but the blends can be worked on. It also looks like it goes from shadow up to basecoat, but no highlights. Pick those smaller spots where the most light would hit and add a bit more brightness. As I said, your work is definitely improving. My advice is keep focusing on those fundamental concepts, continue to work on them and try to push them with each new project. Don't expect to do it all in a day, what you see here is my efforts over 4-5 years of painting. It takes time so don't get frustrated. Find artists and examples that you like and work up to them.

I tried to cover a lot of ground rather quickly, so I hope all that is helpful!
 

DMcc

New member
Voted.

I think you are doing great. You paint a lot better than you did a year a go and you have placed in competitions in the last 12 months. You are improving and you will continue to do so. I wish I could make as much improvement in my painting as you have, and I wont even consider entering a painting competition again.

Its tough feeling in the dark with painting and how to get better, trust me I know. Unless a competition gives score sheets out it will be hard to tell what you did wrong. Sometimes it might be nothing, just someone was a little better, or the judge hated the sculpt of you model. I guess there are many factors out of a painters control.

I guess I am rambling myself, but you should be aware you are painting well now and improving. Slow improvement is still improvement, even still.





Both my entries for the CB are up for voting.. I have also created a new thread on the discuss submission forum for each. My goal this year was to get something through the first cut, which didn't happen. The only trouble with that is that there is no way for me to figure out how my stuff compared score-wise with the rest of the entries, so it leaves me kinda in the dark. Seeing Bailey, BAM and Sionid's stuff along with all the rest of the entries was great, but maybe it's my mind that cannot translate what I saw into what I can/should do. I realize that I will not be able to copy the painting of the place winners, I paint how I paint. There's room to grow I'm sure, most likely very slowly. I'm not even sure why I'm rambling, I blame lack of sleep. Anyways, I would appreciate some votes if you guys get the chance. Thanks.

Khonner

http://www.coolminiornot.com/376531
http://www.coolminiornot.com/376530
 

Khonner

New member
Thanks Canny. I really appreciate your feedback David.. The several examples will definately help. I should be getting that color theory book that BAM suggested tomorrow, so I'm going to have some reading this weekend.
 

Canny

Active member
Benificial for all of us Baily thanks man :)
I wrote my thoughts on your Elric post.
It wont happen over night but it will happen! Any one else get that advert or was it only Auz and NZ?
It became a big saying here.
 
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KruleBear

Active member
I agree with the general sentiment. You continue to get better and if you manage to get sufficient painting time in and continue to learn you will get even better.

And i saw the mini at CB and it deserved to be in the competition even if there were areas for improvement. In fact when i looked at your Elric is when i decided that most of us forumites take shitty pictures. It definitely looked better irl than your photos.
 

moetle

New member
Dude, I think you have great color combinations and a nice style. I can't give any better advice than Canny and Bailey already have, but don't give up, keep painting!
 

ten ball

Active member
Great info bailey :good:
Khonner - i feel your pain mate been through that LOADS of times now, even had a GW member of staff had me back my GD entry and say don't bother!? (I was 14 in the days you entered GD at the store and I'll have to admit to a few tears on the way home on the bus :() I like to find him now and stick my demon up his nose !
Anyway mate just keep painting and you will start getting your goals .
 

BloodASmedium

[img]http://pnp
Great advice from a top tier pa inter and a great helpful human being...their all right ya know khonner you will improve and get better and better I know I have more time on my hands than most people but trust me when I say this all these thing pointed out the only way to practice what's been laid out before you is to put in that time envelope weather you have alot of time or a little just keep bangin out project after project and you'll see your cmon scores go up and a whole slew of things happen that'll translate into "getting better" I can gurantee you this..because it happened to each and every one of us who are now on the end of giving the advice...just keep painting and each time keep in mind that your practicing a certain skill and you'll start becoming more aware...the stop sign rule will get easier and easier and will start to make sense more and more...so don't fret keep up your painting and you'll simply get better Def because you want to.
 

Terrafirma

New member
Khonner , I feel where your coming from , I have also looked at how I have gone wrong .I think each of us paint in a different way but if we can achieve a goal it doesn't matter how we got there. Paint how you paint not how someone else paint but just get better at how you do things. Contrast is contrast for example there are different ways of achieving it but if you paint in your own style you will get better at it. Just my opinion .
 

Khonner

New member
Appreciate all of the comments/feedback. I manged to finish that color theory book and I'm going to try a few things out. Here are my newest projects, just got the base flesh coat on.



 

Khonner

New member
Roughing out the shadows on the skin. Did some work on the cloak and I should be able to attach the shield this weekend. Comments welcomed as always..

 

KruleBear

Active member
The cloak is looking nice with the color variations of real leather. I also like the other color choices.

btw that fireman bust is cool and will be nice to see painted up.
 

moetle

New member
The bust looks fun! I'm working on that lady also, but at the pace of a turtle with a broken leg. The cloak does have a nice leathery feel to it.
 

oistene

Active member
Gotta work on the pictures, though! I want to see the mini, not your glue! ;) Try a sheet of paper behind it to fix the focus.
 

Canny

Active member
Hi Buddy looking great!
You have the perfect mid way shot for your cloak!
I have played with Gimp and done 3 sets of highlights and 3 darks down too 98% black think mahogany and black for the darker tones of glazing and elfic skin tone for the highlights then last one thin glaze of white (making sure it is transucient).

With the shadows make a watery mix of a dark purple, make sure you dont over load your brush wipe it out so there is only a small amount left on it.
Use this to go over the 2 darker stages ONLY. YOU should be able to see it in real life the camera will only just be able to pic it up and the viewer my get a feeling its there but not be able to know for sure.

Edge highlight the hood to make it pop out. with make sure you do it with each lighter tone so its not a stark bright transition making each pass a little smaller.

Edge highlight on the light side of cape and about 25% into the shadow but only use the first 2 highlights save the white for the highest light points.

I have built some volume into the cape with the highlights and shadows. lighter on top and darker on the underside of the folds. And a small cresent around the lower side of the splotches and tear.

I hope this helps :)
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Angel Giraaldez has a nice little wip SBS on his facebook for a nice looking red head, I wonder what he used for reference pics for the boob tube!
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.879412228786352.1073742083.436491416411771&type=1
Sounds odd but you could also add the same purple water to the hair as a wash.

Happy painting my friend :)
 
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Demihuman

Active member
That robe and hair is looking really good! I like the skin too, but you might want to consider shading all of her skin from bottom to top. So that the face is generally the lightest. I guess that sort of conflicts with the stop sign diagram, but it is something to do concurrently.

Also those long sections of skin like her left thigh, you can just throw a gradient on there from top to bottom, even if it doesn't make a ton of sense to how the light would fall it will make those sections a little more interesting and give you some shadows to tune to bring focus back to her knock-out face.

$.02

:)
 

Sionid

New member
Yesss, that cape is looking good. Nice and dirty. Following Canny's advice should make it really pop. This whole piece is already showing a lot of progress!
 
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