Last minute crisis

[AsgardUK]

Hello Guys,

Ive been lurking here since about 2003 i think, sorry i havent posted before, i guess im the quiet type?? So at long last, Hello and thank you to all the fantastic artists on here for the Knowledge and inspiration they supply

i had been on a bit of a break from painting for a while, i think i started up again about 6 months ago and im still yet to finish anything!!

The one miniature i can see the finish line for has just presented me with a bit of a nightmare of a problem and i have a few questions and hoped someone may be able to help me?

Right, i will try to make this quick and to the point, sorry if this ends up as a long post :redface:

I have been painting an oldschool wolf scout sargent and things were going ok, mostly the painting i am doing at the moment is all practice and trying to redescover some old skills and learn some new ones, the problems started when i painted the sword. i based in Tin Bitz then worked the usual bolt gun metal,chainmail, silver thing for highlights, and finally washed with a 50/50 water mix of Tamiya smoke and left to dry, so far so good.

i then started some very basic freehand on the sword, kind of a tribal dogtooth pattern in black with a white outline, left it to dry, once dry i washed again with a diluted mix of Tamiya smoke to try and tone down the freehand and make things tie together and this is where the problem started, to my horror the freehand and base coat started to kind of melt, as if i had used paint stripper? this was clearley a result of the second application of Tamiya smoke, and basically i was left with a load of melted paint on the sword that was unsalvageable

after trying to clean up the original sword i cut my losses and sniped the blade off and attached a new one, which is the last thing i wanted to do to an almost finished mini, i then proceeded to mess up the new sword all over again so that has come off as well.

has anybody else come accross these problems using Tamiya smoke? i have never had this happen using it before?

and secondly, i am a real fan of true metallics, does anyone have any cool tips and tricks for getting metallics to go on smoothley? im fine with toning and shading and all that good stuff, i just have a slight smoothness issue lol.

Oh well looks like it did turn into a long post after all... sorry, i guess thats my fault for staying quiet so long

Thanks for any help

Dan

 

[airhead]

Tamaya paints are not water based acrylics and may not be compatable with certain water based acrylics. Tamaya paints are designed for clear polycarbonic RC car bodies.

Metal paints generally have the least amount of binder and media of a given paint line, making them the most subject to adverse reactions.

In lieu of Tamaya paints, try using Vellajo smoke or a watered down paint or ink.

If you still insist on using the Tamaya, try letting the paint dry well (24 hours or so), then give the mini a shot of Dulcoat and let it cure. Then try the Tamaya. (I wont promise that the Tamaya won\'t react with the clear coat - but it is worth a shot.)

 

[AsgardUK]

Hi Airhead,

Thanks for the reply, i actually have some vallejo smoke, but have not used it yet, i will give it ago thanks.

you mentioned using Dull Coat on the Tamiya smoke, that was also my intention once the mini was finished, and i can see that it may actually solve my problem if i use it part way through the process... The big question if anyone can help is How does Tamiya smoke react to Testors Dull Coat? as a few of the other metallic parts of the mini are finished with a wash of the smoke.

Cheers

 

[demonherald]

I haven\'t come across any adverse reaction with tamiya smoke and dullcote...
Admittedly I have only tried it on a finished model to coat so couldn\'t say wether there will be any effect painting smoke over the dullcote..

couple of things you could try that may help.

1 ..Try vallejo smoke as airhead suggested mix a little citadel black ink in with it and you will get a similar finishto the tamiya.

2. Is it absolutely necessary to do the smoke first.?? If the second smoke wash over the freehand is to tie the freehand in with the base colour more try leaving the wash until the metallics are done and the freehand over it finished that way they will both have the same tone...This may help...the problem maybe due to the paint not adhering to the smoke properly..

3. are ou thinning the smoke? This may help lessen the effect of the solvent in the smoke just thin with a bit of spotlessly clean water and if a second coat is necessary then just do one..

depending f the paint is truly melting or peeling off it could be a case of just slow and steady with the second wash...

aometimes it is purely down to patience leave the freehand to dry for at least 24 hours before attempting the wash.similarly if you go the testors route leave this 24 hours before painting on it...


regards smooth metals I find a couple of things are helping me a lately..

first and foremost make sure the surface they are applied to is perfectly smooth...a big help..Secondly thin and apply in thin coats as youwould any other paint..The pigment in metallics is coarser than other colours and multiple coats will build on each other even as you paint you can see it drying with a texture of the bristles..thin the mix with water and
use metallic medium from vallejo..only a little needed. I find this has helped me a lot...

hope this helps and welcome to the forums now the learning can truly begin....

p.s have a good supply of spare bits and practise different techniques...

 

[Onis Lair]

I use tamiya smoke alot and yes, this happens alot if you don\'t let the first layer of smoke dry completly.

 

[Thecadian]

what do these \'smoke\' products do?
???

james

 

[DrEvilmonki]

Can\'t comment on the smoke as I have never used it. I have however cocked up a sword (5 bloody times!). Fortunately I had only just read about using nail varnish remover on a cotton bud to strip an offending mistake - worked a charm.

As to smoothness of metallics - exactly the same as and other acrylic paint; thin it with water. May take a couple of coats to get full coverage just like any over paint really.

 

[demonherald]

@ cadian ....they\'re kind of like a pre mixed glaze...They tend to give a richer colour than normal glazin and because of th thicker formula tend to tint the whole area they are painted on more...with a bit of practise some cool effects can be achieved with the whole range of tamiya clear stuff...(look at Jacob Nielsens stuff....

 

[AsgardUK]

Thanks for the replies guys

@ Demonherald, you have given me some great food for thought, i dont think it is absolutely necessary to use 2 coats of smoke, to be honest the freehand was added as an afterthought first time round so on my next try i will incorporate it into the normal painting process and glaze once at the end.

Also thanks for the tips on smooth metallics, i only seem to get the problem on weapons, and it is exactley how you describe so i will thin my paints even more and add a little metal medium, or possibly matt medium and see how it goes!

@ TheCadian Hi mate, as Demonherald said the smoke products are glazes, kind of a mix of brown purple and black, you can get some cool effects on metallics using them, a few tips are to thin the smoke, it just looks better, more realistic. and also adding other inks in very small amounts to the smoke can give some great tones, one of my favorites is to add a tiny drop of purple ink to Tamiya smoke and glaze over metalics that have been highlighted up to mitril silver, not for every mini but used at the right time can look cool

Thanks again

Dan