Lucky to be alive
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@Brimshack you make a very solid point. Of course looking at it that way, my existence makes complete sense: just as much as any other person\'s. Extending on your argumentation, one could almost go so far as to say there is no chance, correct? The coin, thrown at the exact speed and angle with which it was thrown; in the conditions of the given time and place, could only end up one way.
In other words are chance/randomness/probability etc. concepts that exist only as theoretical human creations?
I definitely see the logic behind this kind of reasoning. Heck, I fully agree with it! What causes the problem for me is, well, me. This is going to sound contradictory and self-centered but I guess I just can\'t seem to look at myself as just another part in the grand scheme of things. Don\'t get me wrong: I\'m not trying to say I\'m special (other than from my own point of view of course). I\'m just saying the concept of my consciousness is something I find hard to understand. Okay, even if we exclude questions like \"why?\" and \"how come me and not him/her?\" there still remains ones like \"when and how did I come in to being?\"; \"how did nothing become something?\".
But as I said, I do agree with what you\'re saying!
@point #1: You\'re right. However, I think being human does! Throughout history, people have been searching answers. Religion was (and is still for a lot of people) a crucial way to give us these answers. However, with the advancements in science many of these by religions provided answers have been made somewhat superfluos. But a certain few haven\'t. This one for instance. And for me not being able to find the answer in science, and not being able to believe what\'s offered by religion, creates a feeling of helplessness.
@point #2: I guess you have the evidence on your side on this one
Yeah, impossible was a poor choice of word.
Anyway thanks for a really great reply. Looking at it like that definitely makes me feel less frustrated (in lack of a better word).
@funnymouth: Interesting stuff. Especially in conjuction with what Brimshack wrote.
@Dragonsreach: Well good for you!
But I would hardly call being content with the ability to raise the questions a sign of \"true enlightenment\" I want answers :bouncy:
In other words are chance/randomness/probability etc. concepts that exist only as theoretical human creations?
I definitely see the logic behind this kind of reasoning. Heck, I fully agree with it! What causes the problem for me is, well, me. This is going to sound contradictory and self-centered but I guess I just can\'t seem to look at myself as just another part in the grand scheme of things. Don\'t get me wrong: I\'m not trying to say I\'m special (other than from my own point of view of course). I\'m just saying the concept of my consciousness is something I find hard to understand. Okay, even if we exclude questions like \"why?\" and \"how come me and not him/her?\" there still remains ones like \"when and how did I come in to being?\"; \"how did nothing become something?\".
But as I said, I do agree with what you\'re saying!
@point #1: You\'re right. However, I think being human does! Throughout history, people have been searching answers. Religion was (and is still for a lot of people) a crucial way to give us these answers. However, with the advancements in science many of these by religions provided answers have been made somewhat superfluos. But a certain few haven\'t. This one for instance. And for me not being able to find the answer in science, and not being able to believe what\'s offered by religion, creates a feeling of helplessness.
@point #2: I guess you have the evidence on your side on this one
Yeah, impossible was a poor choice of word. Anyway thanks for a really great reply. Looking at it like that definitely makes me feel less frustrated (in lack of a better word).
@funnymouth: Interesting stuff. Especially in conjuction with what Brimshack wrote.
@Dragonsreach: Well good for you!
But I would hardly call being content with the ability to raise the questions a sign of \"true enlightenment\"
I want answers :bouncy:And here it is: stop looking for the answers to life, the universe and everything.
The secret of life is to live it. Make friends, love passionately, experience something new every day, call and talk to someone you know just because you can. Do something. Don\'t just exist; live.
Looking for answers or for \"what it all means\" is futile. If we\'re lucky, we won\'t know for quite some time. Because the day you get the all of the answers, is the day you die.
Of course, all of that is just my opinion.
farseerlum
New member
if i have learnt anything from this thread then i am now not who i was before reading it.
this thread kills.
this thread kills.
Duende
New member
Aww, don\'t make fun guys. I find this to be a real interseting topic to read. It\'s something I\'ve wondered about a lot myself, - just how did I end up being \"me\". How was it I was born where I was, when I was and have the attributes I do? I\'ve never been really religious, but found that it doesn\'t answer these questions for me anyway, it just seems to be a lot of rules about how I should act.
I\'m almost relived to know this also crosses the minds of others and am enjoying hearing their thoughts on it.
I\'m almost relived to know this also crosses the minds of others and am enjoying hearing their thoughts on it.
Dragon Forge Design
New member
My theory exactly..You beat me to the post..I was going to say \"Shit Happens..Untill then enjoy the ride.\"
To be, or not to be: that is the question:
Whether \'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die: to sleep;
No more; and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to, \'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish\'d. To die, to sleep;
To sleep: perchance to dream: ay, there\'s the rub;
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause: there\'s the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;
For who would bear the whips and scorns of time,
The oppressor\'s wrong, the proud man\'s contumely,
The pangs of despised love, the law\'s delay,
The insolence of office and the spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscover\'d country from whose bourn
No traveller returns, puzzles the will
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all;
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o\'er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action.--Soft you now!
The fair Ophelia! Nymph, in thy orisons
Be all my sins remember\'d.
Whether \'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die: to sleep;
No more; and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to, \'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish\'d. To die, to sleep;
To sleep: perchance to dream: ay, there\'s the rub;
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause: there\'s the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;
For who would bear the whips and scorns of time,
The oppressor\'s wrong, the proud man\'s contumely,
The pangs of despised love, the law\'s delay,
The insolence of office and the spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscover\'d country from whose bourn
No traveller returns, puzzles the will
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all;
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o\'er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action.--Soft you now!
The fair Ophelia! Nymph, in thy orisons
Be all my sins remember\'d.
Heh, the problem of consciousness is rather difficult. I gave up trying to make sense of it years ago. At any rate, I certainly don\'t fault you for the interest. That one seems to creep into a few different topics. I just don\'t think the probability formulation helps much.
I\'d have to say the website that produced it is more than a little odd. Militant naturalism, with links to American Atheists no less (last I checked their definition of \"Atheism\" would have been more appropriately applied to \"metaphysical naturalism\"), then with that bit of mysticism thrown in. It\'s not quite a contradiction, but those passages on the miracle of one\'s own existence do feel a bit like a peak into someone\'s self doubts.
Just saw this thread - great stuff.
@funnymouth - I can\'t get over that conjugation tube on that bacterium. I don\'t think there will be any difficulty with that one passing on its genetic material. Imagine that translated into our scale!
I find consciousness much more interesting than existence. Let\'s face it - if there are a few basic chemical building blocks around and a little bit of energy, life will happen. Whether you want to bring divine intervention into the equation is a matter of personal preference.
It is clear that consciousness is a function of a healthy brain, and presumably can be broken down to basic biochemical interactions. Why then do we behave so differently? Are animals \"conscious\" as well, since they too have brains that function like ours? If consciousness deterimines whether someone exists (I think therefore I am), what happens when we are unconscious? Do we die \"temporarily\"? Very fun questions to ponder.
@funnymouth - I can\'t get over that conjugation tube on that bacterium. I don\'t think there will be any difficulty with that one passing on its genetic material. Imagine that translated into our scale!
I find consciousness much more interesting than existence. Let\'s face it - if there are a few basic chemical building blocks around and a little bit of energy, life will happen. Whether you want to bring divine intervention into the equation is a matter of personal preference.
It is clear that consciousness is a function of a healthy brain, and presumably can be broken down to basic biochemical interactions. Why then do we behave so differently? Are animals \"conscious\" as well, since they too have brains that function like ours? If consciousness deterimines whether someone exists (I think therefore I am), what happens when we are unconscious? Do we die \"temporarily\"? Very fun questions to ponder.
funnymouth
Active member
Originally posted by supervike
Originally posted by treide
I can\'t get over that conjugation tube on that bacterium. I don\'t think there will be any difficulty with that one passing on its genetic material. Imagine that translated into our scale!
What scale? 28mm? lollol
lol killin\' me fella\'s
got to agree triede, conciousness is a toughie, but great fun to think about. its also interesting to ponder the ultimate question: which animal has the largest proportional junk. well i sirs, happen to know the answer.
If you were born 100 years ago you\'d be really, really old.
Anyway, I used to know the answer to the junk proportions question. Isn\'t there a whale or something with like 6% body weight in genitals? Been too long since I\'ve seen that particular show on Discovery Channel lol
I\'m half expecting someone to chime in with \"Hey, you guys are talking about me again aren\'t you?\" or something to that effect
Slightly more serious: It\'s something you have to take on faith in the end, but I think the mathematical improbability of life and/or divergent evolution is pretty convincing evidence of Creation.
Amino acids are ridiculously uncommon in nature, they really don\'t exist outside living things/dead things very often, and to have a bunch of them randomly combine to form a self-replicating chain that survived long enough to evolve organelles and all that stuff is insane. Then factor in the necessary amount of adaptive mutation in order to have such an incredibly rich (and often fragile) biodiversity and it\'s pretty staggering in a hurry.
And I\'m completely ignoring the whole formation of a life sustaining environment, that\'s more of a \"given\" due to the amount of planets/solar systems out there.
At any rate, I lay no claim to unlocking all the mysteries of God\'s wonderful Creation, but at the end of the day (and during the day for that matter) I\'m glad to know the Creator of the universe, even if my tiny brain couldn\'t fathom a tiny fraction of the knowledge He surely has.
farseerlum
New member
6% of it\'s weight in junk? not bad when you consider that when it lets loose it fires off 3% of it\'s weight in ammo.
blue whale fires off 1 ton rounds. i believe it to be a major contributor to the rising sea levels.
blue whale fires off 1 ton rounds. i believe it to be a major contributor to the rising sea levels.
