school shootings
- Thread starter spazzy
- Start date
wiccanpony
Official Freak Bar Witch
it\'s a scary trend.....will we have to include buying bullet-proof vests along with back to school items.At first it seemed to be a freakish random event, this kid can\'t handle being teased anymore, only in large cities and very very far from home. Last school year there were some 58 school shootings in the US during the school year, and when I read the report last week we were up to 18 this year, since August 1.
The Amish school shooting really got to me. Incredibly small school, and the milk delivery man shot ten girls between the ages of 4 and 16, killing 5 of them. How am I supposed to feel comfortable about sending my kid to school? Obviously being in a small community doesn\'t exempt us.
The Amish school shooting really got to me. Incredibly small school, and the milk delivery man shot ten girls between the ages of 4 and 16, killing 5 of them. How am I supposed to feel comfortable about sending my kid to school? Obviously being in a small community doesn\'t exempt us.
I think this is pretty much an American phenomena.
We must remember that this latest one is actually quite a different thing from the others, in that it wasn\'t a socially ostacized student, but rather a madman.
I had as much pity for the shooters in the other events as for the victims, because their lives must have been a living hell to have been driven to that point. In the long run maybe some good will come out of those, with schools trying to help counsil kids instead of looking the other way.
This new one was a pedophile nutjob, and I hope this doesn\'t give ideas to other freaks. The U.S. seems to have MANY problems with pyschotic behaviour, so I think your question should be do other countries see this sort of \'Rampage Killing\', or even an occasional serial killer?
We must remember that this latest one is actually quite a different thing from the others, in that it wasn\'t a socially ostacized student, but rather a madman.
I had as much pity for the shooters in the other events as for the victims, because their lives must have been a living hell to have been driven to that point. In the long run maybe some good will come out of those, with schools trying to help counsil kids instead of looking the other way.
This new one was a pedophile nutjob, and I hope this doesn\'t give ideas to other freaks. The U.S. seems to have MANY problems with pyschotic behaviour, so I think your question should be do other countries see this sort of \'Rampage Killing\', or even an occasional serial killer?
Not strictly American. We have it here too. Schools are allowed neither to discipline nor search the kids, both violate their human rights. The rights of the kid who objects against the safety of all.
Mind you, violence isn\'t limited to shootings alone, a kid who attacks another with a pair of scissors was just \'unfortunate\' he couldn\'t find a gun.
Mind you, violence isn\'t limited to shootings alone, a kid who attacks another with a pair of scissors was just \'unfortunate\' he couldn\'t find a gun.
No Such Agency
New member
Yeah right. Remember after the Columbine shootings, kids couldn\'t so much as wear a black jacket to school without being sent for mandatory \"counselling\" - aka \"please tell us something odd so we can expel you\". Kids were being suspended, expelled and/or criminally charged for drawing a gun in their notebook, or pointing a french fry and saying \"bang!\". Unusual kids were picked on more than ever, only now they were hearing \"Trenchcoat mafia!\" as they got their asses kicked.
Your kid still has a greater chance of being killed by lightning than by a school shooter. Well, okay, maybe not lighting, but there are a hell of a lot of things that I\'d worry about before this.
Remember, \"if it bleeds it leads\" - the media love to pump this shit for all it\'s worth. Making you scared makes you watch the news more, after all.
AinuLainour
New member
As well as America, there\'s also the recent shooting at Douglas College in Montreal Canada. But it\'s still not a common occurence..
airhead
Coffin Dodger / Keymaster
Because schools are guaranteed free-fire zones. No guns allowed. Just like most government buildings (except the court house where the judges are allowed to conceal carry.)
I truely feel for those kids. They did not stand a chance.
I know it has been happening for a while, but after Columbine, it has kind of become a fad place to go commit suicide - and take a few innocent children with you. I think the people that do that are the worst form of cowards.
And the news magnifies the issue to be sure. They are in much more statistical danger on the drive to and from school than actually at school.
I truely feel for those kids. They did not stand a chance.
I know it has been happening for a while, but after Columbine, it has kind of become a fad place to go commit suicide - and take a few innocent children with you. I think the people that do that are the worst form of cowards.
And the news magnifies the issue to be sure. They are in much more statistical danger on the drive to and from school than actually at school.
this shooting is nothing new. i grew up around it.
i don\'t want to make this a race thing but if it doesn\'t happen in the white communities most people don\'t give a shit.
i remember having homeboys getting shot in pacioma schools which is mostly hispanics and not a word in the news or the papers.
i saw a boy get shot in the chest after school and the next day three sentences in the paper and no follow up.
you think this new? well guess what it not.
i don\'t want to make this a race thing but if it doesn\'t happen in the white communities most people don\'t give a shit.
i remember having homeboys getting shot in pacioma schools which is mostly hispanics and not a word in the news or the papers.
i saw a boy get shot in the chest after school and the next day three sentences in the paper and no follow up.
you think this new? well guess what it not.
philologus
Subgenius
I agree with NSA here. The news inflates peoples perceptions of event frequency/intensity. School shootings were on the decline after Columbine; until the last three weeks. Many people don\'t know that the most damaging occurrence of school violence in the U.S. happened in 1927. 45 people were killed. 38 were children. A disgruntled citizen wired the entire school with explosives. (search for Bath school massacre)
BTW: If all else fails Spazzy you can home school. After several years of sending our kids to private school; we decided to start teaching at home.
To clarify what Ainu was saying...
There as been a shooting at Dawson college three weeks ago ( I think.) one dead 19 wounded...
It\'s the eight time at least one person is killed in a public school in Quebec alone, considering the population ( 7G) it IS considerably recurrent, worst than in the state if you make an average.
Have we occidentals fucked up our kids you think?
Completely. Shame on us
The drive exists inside everybody, we are all potential murderer and the line is thin, we really need to remember that, instead of making editorials to emphasize that the perpetrator is an evil maniac.
We should look into our ways to find the problem, no blaming nor victimizing is ever gonna solve the problem, only make it worst.
@Dendawg: Racial issue? of the eight shootings here, the majority were
white people, making it a racial issue would probably be the most stupid an irresponsible thing a society could do.
And thats what is happening.
There as been a shooting at Dawson college three weeks ago ( I think.) one dead 19 wounded...
It\'s the eight time at least one person is killed in a public school in Quebec alone, considering the population ( 7G) it IS considerably recurrent, worst than in the state if you make an average.
Have we occidentals fucked up our kids you think?
Completely. Shame on us
The drive exists inside everybody, we are all potential murderer and the line is thin, we really need to remember that, instead of making editorials to emphasize that the perpetrator is an evil maniac.
We should look into our ways to find the problem, no blaming nor victimizing is ever gonna solve the problem, only make it worst.
@Dendawg: Racial issue? of the eight shootings here, the majority were
white people, making it a racial issue would probably be the most stupid an irresponsible thing a society could do.
And thats what is happening.
demonherald
New member
This goes way too deep and could end up in some dark places........
it\'s happened here in the UK there was also the whole incident with the machette wielding nutter...
unfortunately random psychos catch everyone unprepared..there is work happening to help combat bullying etc which will hopefully help in the future but the justice systm is so screwed up around the world that if people want to do it they will and the further they go and the more outrageous the bigger there fame factor and the more likelihood they will be classed as mentally unstable..
whatever the causes it is a sad thing whenever anything like this happens.
it\'s happened here in the UK there was also the whole incident with the machette wielding nutter...
unfortunately random psychos catch everyone unprepared..there is work happening to help combat bullying etc which will hopefully help in the future but the justice systm is so screwed up around the world that if people want to do it they will and the further they go and the more outrageous the bigger there fame factor and the more likelihood they will be classed as mentally unstable..
whatever the causes it is a sad thing whenever anything like this happens.
Torn blue sky
New member
I really don\'t get this phenomina. Motives are mixed. Some just want a \"Target rich\" enviroment, so why not target an office???
America\'s a large continant remember, so instances are bound to be more frequent and the fact it\'s renown area brings more publicity. This isn\'t to say its not just as frequent as,say, africa.
I also feel a great amount of sadness for the victims. As previously stated, they don\'t stand a snowballs chance in hell. the fact theyre so young also lends greatly to the tragedy.
I can (Kind of) understand your concerns spazzy. Not being a Parent myself, I wouldn\'t truly know. Truth (and sad fact) of the matter is, your right, theres not really any safeguards in place to prevent it.
America\'s a large continant remember, so instances are bound to be more frequent and the fact it\'s renown area brings more publicity. This isn\'t to say its not just as frequent as,say, africa.
I also feel a great amount of sadness for the victims. As previously stated, they don\'t stand a snowballs chance in hell. the fact theyre so young also lends greatly to the tragedy.
I can (Kind of) understand your concerns spazzy. Not being a Parent myself, I wouldn\'t truly know. Truth (and sad fact) of the matter is, your right, theres not really any safeguards in place to prevent it.
Torn blue sky
New member
Point. The media is the peoples ear. If you don\'t hear it, you don\'t know it\'s there.
I am sure you did not mean that I could be ignorant of what happens in schools with large gang populations, minority populations, socioeconimically depressed populations, etc. However, I do want to be clear that I am painfully aware of some of the problems involved with the school systems that are mainly populated in this way. My husband was a military police officer in Ft Bliss, El Paso. He had a lot of involvement with border patroll and drug teams which worked in the public schools. Violence was something children there were expesed to regularly, what with Latin Kings, Crypts, and Bloods, as well as every other little punk that wanted to be rotten. The difference is that those are known dangers. We moved specifically to the area we did to give our children a safer environment to grow up in. Seeing a random nutjob tear into an Amish school take away the nice comfy feeling of safety that we had here.
And, NSA, you are right. Statistically I should be worrying about other things. But, I do everything in my control to make that trip to and from school more safe. She has a seat belt, a booster seat, window curtain airbags, crumple zones on the vehicle, as well as safe, defensive driving practices. Once I leave her at the school, I have no control over her safety anymore. I believe that it is that that concerns me the most. I have no control.
Phil, we are discussing private school options. As far as homeschool, I really don\'t think she would get the social interaction necessary. If you live in a larger area that has more community activities that children may be involved in, then there isn\'t a concern for that, but here we don\'t have much at all.
Spazzy : You are a mother. you will be concerned and worried about your children ALL your life. Even last year at the age of 74 my mother was worried about my safety after I was given a Bandsaw as a present. (I\'m 50 and put workshop safety as a high priority).
Violence in schools is sadly not just an issue in the USA. Here in the UK the incidence of pupil assaults has risen and again the media choose not to report some of the incidents unless it involves a death.
Working in an Education authority I get to hear some of the stories, A teacher hit by a pupil with a bicycle chain wrapped around a fist, a 10 year old with ADHD attacking another 10 year old and strangling him until the victim was turning Blue. These are just some of the issues I\'ve heard since the start of this school year.
Although I am not a parent, I do understand the concerns of mothers and fathers about safeguarding their children.
We cannot blame society in general, because we are to blame for allowing the culture of defending individual \"human rights\" to rule in preference to the protection of human rights for groups. We elect our governments (supposedly) on their blankets agendas and then bemoan the fact that they (our Govt\'s) do not carry out our will. We have forgotten that governments are our servants, not the reverse and so we are to blame for not acting to ensure that our governments act according to our wishes.
It\'s an uphill struggle for parents who want to ensure the safety of their children in schools because we have allowed the attitude and culture of indifference to take a hold to the extent that so many people now feel powerless to effect any change.
If you wish to effect a change you must act, and to act you must become active. This means organisation of pressure groups and political activity, something to which few people can subscribe. But to those that do take this path, I give you all my moral support and my best wishes.
beowulfthehunter
New member
I have a unique take on things. I was one of those kids who was harrased by students all thoughout school. At one point I went to far as to take a knife to protect myself but my mom stopped me. I was bullied a great deal and it has affect my selfesteem a great deal even years after the teasing has stopped.
Now I am an educator. I have worked mostly with special education students and let me tell you these are the type of kids who do stupid stuff like that. A great deal of students with behavior disorders are the same kids in school that already have a criminal record.
The reason we have school violence is simply because we must have these students in our schools. Years back we could kick these kids out into the wind and hope they get stabbed in some back alley but now due to Governmental policies like No Child Left behind we have to try to educate these children who not only do not want to be in school but disrupt classes so that those who want to learn cannot.
School violence has gone down over the years but due to the media shoving it in our face we are led to belive it was an every day occurance. It is not and the only reason we care so much about these mas shootings is becasue the ammount of attention causes others to copy them. I would be willing to bet you my painting arm below the elbow that if there was was not so much coverage of stuff like this it would not happen.
Another reason we care so much is because these events happen to white people. There is a Chris Rock joke that says Durgs only became an eppidemic when white people started getting hooked.
The Amish shooting was a tragedy no doubt but it was a freak occurance. Statisticaly you have a better chance of meeting you maker other ways I would not worry about it for the safty of your child.
Now I am an educator. I have worked mostly with special education students and let me tell you these are the type of kids who do stupid stuff like that. A great deal of students with behavior disorders are the same kids in school that already have a criminal record.
The reason we have school violence is simply because we must have these students in our schools. Years back we could kick these kids out into the wind and hope they get stabbed in some back alley but now due to Governmental policies like No Child Left behind we have to try to educate these children who not only do not want to be in school but disrupt classes so that those who want to learn cannot.
School violence has gone down over the years but due to the media shoving it in our face we are led to belive it was an every day occurance. It is not and the only reason we care so much about these mas shootings is becasue the ammount of attention causes others to copy them. I would be willing to bet you my painting arm below the elbow that if there was was not so much coverage of stuff like this it would not happen.
Another reason we care so much is because these events happen to white people. There is a Chris Rock joke that says Durgs only became an eppidemic when white people started getting hooked.
The Amish shooting was a tragedy no doubt but it was a freak occurance. Statisticaly you have a better chance of meeting you maker other ways I would not worry about it for the safty of your child.
paintingploddy
New member
I can say that in my experience I haven\'t seen an upsurge in violent crime reported in schools. I don\'t have any statistics though, just what i come across day to day.
That said crime can be like road safety or workplace accidents. You get trends (like burglars targeting a particular neighbourhood) and then you can get statistical blips (like two or three plane crashes happening over a short period). The current spate of shootings is one such blip. A number of unconnected gunmen reacting to things happening in their totally unconnected lives decide to act and kill. They may be influenced by what is on the news, but it is largely a coincidence.
And I also agree the media fixates on what it believes the audience wants. It takes a truly terrible disaster in Africa or Asia for us to hear about it, but we regularly hear of tornadoes in the US killing a couple of people.
Lastly your child is in more danger on the roads than in school. Just make sure your child isn\'t the one that snaps.
That said crime can be like road safety or workplace accidents. You get trends (like burglars targeting a particular neighbourhood) and then you can get statistical blips (like two or three plane crashes happening over a short period). The current spate of shootings is one such blip. A number of unconnected gunmen reacting to things happening in their totally unconnected lives decide to act and kill. They may be influenced by what is on the news, but it is largely a coincidence.
And I also agree the media fixates on what it believes the audience wants. It takes a truly terrible disaster in Africa or Asia for us to hear about it, but we regularly hear of tornadoes in the US killing a couple of people.
Lastly your child is in more danger on the roads than in school. Just make sure your child isn\'t the one that snaps.
