Sniping?

[ScottRadom]

Okay, look, not trying to piss any (more) people off but the topic of siniping has come up again and I just want to know if it\'s possible to actually do it. Just some simple questions and I don\'t really want to debate what sniping is or if it happens.

-I thought there was a filter that eliminated votes either too high or too low from the existing score. Is that accurate?

-I tried to vote on a couple of my models and gave them 1\'s and it did not alter the score. Can you vote on your own models at all?

-For my settings registered votes appear in yellow, meaning there must be some sort of system that attaches votes to certain users. If someone wanted to, would it be possible to look at the voting history for a model and ascertain if a string of 1\'s were in fact issued?

-The scores given next to public comments, are they actually considered votes? Do they mix in with the other votes to count towards the average score?

Thanks to any who can share the answers.

 

[Necroghast]

Same questions!

 

[War Griffon]

How many votes had your entries received before you started to give them 1\'s? If they already had more than 50 votes then it would take longer for the actual score to change.

If you had less than 50 votes the the algarithm thingy would not kick in until 50 votes was achieved i.e. you scores would reflect what has been voted but at 50 votes then very low or very high scores may be removed by the system to reflect your true average score.

Thats the way I see it/it has been explained to me in the past )

 

[Theomar Pius]

Scores givin with the comments do not count towards the overall score, and are actually quite meaningless.

 

[Cleezy]

I thought this was gona be a thread to do with sniping on fps games haha.

I habe cod on the brain

 

[airhead]

Originally posted by ScottRadom-I thought there was a filter that eliminated votes either too high or too low from the existing score. Is that accurate?

There is. But the true workings of it are secret.

-I tried to vote on a couple of my models and gave them 1\'s and it did not alter the score.

The scores are only recalculated once per day. Did you wait or just expect imeadiate change?

Can you vote on your own models at all?

yes

-For my settings registered votes appear in yellow, meaning there must be some sort of system that attaches votes to certain users. If someone wanted to, would it be possible to look at the voting history for a model and ascertain if a string of 1\'s were in fact issued?

don\'t know

-The scores given next to public comments, are they actually considered votes? Do they mix in with the other votes to count towards the average score?

as said. they have no value other than to tell the person and subsequent viewers how you voted.

Thanks to any who can share the answers.

 

[ScottRadom]

War Griffon- My models had more than 50 votes each. I voted on model snot in my top 5 (Not affecting my equally meaningless rnaking!) and I waited a while, 2 days at least.

As for affecting the outcome only on a daily basis, I note that when I vote on a model with very few votes, as the next image loads and the recently voted on image gets kicked to the top right portion of the screen and it\'s new average does include my vote. Is this new total truly not calculated immediately, or is the image sort of indicating a \"running total\" that will not be made official until the end of the day?

But what I was after is that there is indeed a filter/algorithm that prevents sniping, but not until the 50 vote mark has been achieved?

Sniping is possible, but not after 50 votes? Or will the algorithm back track once 50 is reached and stabilize the score?

Cleezy- I feel your pain brutha

Airhead - Thanks for the answers sir!

Theomar - I find the comments I recieve to be of great value, and I certainly appreciate anyone taking the time to post one. The score is nice to use as a benchmark, and I like the fact that someone can give me a ridiculously high score (or low) and justify it with a comment.

Thanks to all for taking the time. I\'m just chasing down a curious itch I\'ve had for a while about this subject.

 

[Amazon warrior]

I really wish there wasn\'t the score thing attached to the comments. For ages I assumed that it meant that I had voted on that mini, so I\'d skip on to the next one. Also, I don\'t like how it could potentially swing the vote if you see that so-and-so gave it a 7, by Bloggs1008 gave it a 9. Plus so many people qualify it by saying \"Oh, I think it\'s a 8.5\" when the score next to their comment says 6 because they forgot to change the damn thing.



*Note to self - do not type when drunk. It is hard* :drunk::drunk::drunk:

 

[Dragonsreach]

The alorgithm has been explained before like this:-
Daily the scores are calculated and any which are \"widely skewed\" from the average vote and current rating are discounted. (i.e. a figure with mostly 8\'s getting a range of 1\'s or a figure with 4\'s getting a heap of 10\'s).

Sniping can be classed into two main types:-
People who think it\'s \"fun\" to vote every thing a One because they have no respect for others work. (and yes we all know people like that).
Submitters on here who vote a One on high (or higher) scoring miniatures than their own. (and while there is no evidence strong enough to stand up in court, it was observed, in the behaviour of one former member).

Personally as the voting system is \"Open\" to non members it\'s become moot to me. (If I could get a pict I\'d be happy to post at the moment) What is more relevant is the opinions and comments posted, either in forums or directly on the images.

As a matter of interest over the last week or so I\'ve been keeping mental reckoning of the ratio of comments to images I\'ve approved and it\'s running around 4-6 images for every comment I approve.

 

[Kester]

Can we not close the voting to non members?

 

[BarstoolProphet]

Originally posted by Kester
Can we not close the voting to non members?

Heh. Make all votes public, too. That\'d teach \'em!

 

[green stuff]

Message original : Kester
Can we not close the voting to non members?

http://www.coolminiornot.com/forums/viewthread.php?tid=2752

http://www.coolminiornot.com/forums/viewthread.php?tid=20955

 

[ScottRadom]

I truly wasn\'t looking to open the floodgates for debates on sniping and such. My personal belief is that it doesn\'t happen as much as people think. I find it just as likely that some votes are made higher then likely deserved based on model or personal preference. Check out my gallery and there\'s a few models with comments and marks of 9\'s and 10\'s. I didn\'t paint that well, they\'re just ecnouraging and wonderful comments.

I know that we maybe shouldn\'t put a lot of stock into the scores of our models, but I do anyway. I\'ve found the scores are ALWAYS less then I\'d hoped, but after some reflection I feel they\'re very fair. Things I often look at after I\'ve submitted a model....

-I pay more attention to the registered voters score. It\'s often lower, but I feel that the people who\'ve subscribed to this site are more likely to vote a model fairly based on painting skill, style choices, and model selections vs. the \"Joe Plumber\" who may just vote a model a 9 because he thinks Forge World is cool, and not pay attention to the fact that I simply drybrushed the hell out of a fig with not much skill involved.

-Comments and more comments. Every comment left on a pic is a piece of treasure to me. I\'ve had some ecnouraging ones left and I\'ve had some semi instructional ones left that helped me get better. Putting a post in the \"discuss submission\" is a great way to learn as well.

-Shop and compare! I did a AoW Goblin hero a little while back and as I finished painting him I was pretty sure I would be getting an 8 or higher on that model. Turns out I didn\'t (6.7 right now) and I WAS dissapointed. So I did a filter for models 8 or higher and checked the gallery. My work DID NOT belong alongside those models. I would reccomend anyone painting for a certain becnhmark score take the time to do the same thing. It can be an eye opener!

-Photography! Get better at it! My pics suck the big one. I have not taken the time to read many of the excellent articles posted here on using a camera better for mini phtography. The score will always be limited by the picture so if you/I want to get better scores then it will require the very least some time invested in learning that part of the submission process as well.

So that\'s me. I will of course allow that sniping happens around here, I just think that it\'s not as popular a pastime as we\'d like to think.

Of course I am now opening myself up some hard core sniping as well.....

 

[alextheartist]

What about people who get their friends to vote them up?? Sad bastards..

http://www.coolminiornot.com/210677
http://www.coolminiornot.com/210057

and yes i am picking on this one guy.. i dont care if people snipe me cos of this, go get a life


Bear in mind, these are getting the same scores as shauns steampunk dragon..


Alex

 

[ScottRadom]

Well the second link has a comment from a guy, not sure if he\'s sarcastic or not. But if you look at both those figs the registered average is a little closer to where I, and it sounds like you, would put the model.

I agree with you 100% on friends amping the score up. I\'ve had plenty of my figs voted a little higher then I think they desereve (in hindsight of course), probably because of positive feedback I have given them.

 

[atacam]

Originally posted by alextheartist
What about people who get their friends to vote them up?? Sad bastards..

http://www.coolminiornot.com/210677
http://www.coolminiornot.com/210057

and yes i am picking on this one guy.. i dont care if people snipe me cos of this, go get a life


Bear in mind, these are getting the same scores as shauns steampunk dragon..


Alex

I see what you mean. How has he managed to get a 9, and I haven\'t. Not being big headed but I think I ma marginally better!?!?!

Anyway back to the voting thing. Sniping is a way of life get used to it. If you can\'t be thick skinned, then dont post. That was what I was told anyway. I have really posted anything here for an age, as I got tired of seeing minis getting continuously higher scores, when even Stevie Wonder could see it didn\'t deserve it. Did deflate me a little.

To get high scores you either have to turn out an exceptional job, and there are some, or be certain popular people as CMON is a popularity contest too.

For the most this is still a great site, with some great people and give great inspiration, so stick around, just don\'t get too hung up on the scores. I would prefer to see comments, on my minis, but this is such a rare thing, that it makes them worth all the more.

 

[ScottRadom]

Atacam- No I personally am not concerened about sniping. I think my models are scored fairly (low!) and the answers to my questions about the actual technical parameters of the voting system are encouraging.

I was involved in a bit of a eShouting match in another thread over the issue of sniping. Abbreviated version is I don\'t think it\'s fair to say a low scoring model has been sniped.

It happesn, I understand that, and my skin is reasonably bulletproof. Some would say not to take the scores to heart but I feel the opposite. I think the scores are usually bang on (for my stuff) and I can track a progression from my first submissions to now. Love the site, love the voting, and I look forward to bigger and better scores.

And yes I think your own skills are pretty slick and I\'d like to see you post more pics.

 

[atacam]

Originally posted by ScottRadom
Atacam- No I personally am not concerened about sniping. I think my models are scored fairly (low!) and the answers to my questions about the actual technical parameters of the voting system are encouraging.

I was involved in a bit of a eShouting match in another thread over the issue of sniping. Abbreviated version is I don\'t think it\'s fair to say a low scoring model has been sniped.

It happesn, I understand that, and my skin is reasonably bulletproof. Some would say not to take the scores to heart but I feel the opposite. I think the scores are usually bang on (for my stuff) and I can track a progression from my first submissions to now. Love the site, love the voting, and I look forward to bigger and better scores.

And yes I think your own skills are pretty slick and I\'d like to see you post more pics.

Thanks Scott. Once I have learned how to use a camera, I may re-indulge one day.

 

[alextheartist]

I know, i mean my stuff isnt the best, but if stuff like this:

http://coolminiornot.com/210576

is only a 9.3, there is somthing wrong.

One is out of focus, a quater finished and tbh, not that well painted, no way should it be 8.6!!

I\'m not complaining about the system, just this one guy who is abusing it.

Alex

 

[ScottRadom]

It\'s more than one dude I\'m sure. Thing is... I don\'t get it... Maybe if you\'re auctioning stuff off it helps to say this fig is an 8.1 on CMON but do you go to the LGS and brag up a not fully painted fig and say \"Dude, check it out, I rocked this for an 8.6 on CMON. Now, who wants to stand next to me, only 10$ for every 5 minutes...\"

I don\'t understand.

Anyway I am all for the system. I think even, or maybe especially, when models are scored low it should serve as a notice that the community finds something a little lacking vs. your expected score. I wish more people took the time to leave feedback but I know I don\'t on most models I view either.

And I do think the fact that there is a system in place to filter some anomalous votes helps as well.

For the record I really dug the SS trooper. Exceptionally well painted but I think the score is fine. If it was a 28mm it would blow me away but I think at 120mm that level of detail can be expected around here. Not from my brush, but never the less. I scored it a 10, wishing there was a 9.5 button.