What does it take to rate a 7+?

Daft

New member
4=tabletop quality
5=Clean work with some nice basework
6=Clean work, nice basework, somethig stands out.

That is how I rate things but 7+ is more difficult. Does it need to have conversion, or NMM?

NMM is another pet peve of mine. Why does good (not fabulous) NMM rate above high quality metalics? Rarley do Minis using real metalics get a rating above a 6. It really annoys.
 

Brokenblade

New member
Hi, Welcome to the forums,

I don\'t think conversions are at all neccessary for a 7, i think what\'s most important is a good clean paintjob that shows a fair bit of quality,

The reason nmm is used so often is probably because metallics are much harder to paint and make it blatent that they are well painted, whereas with nmm it is usually more obvious as to whether it\'s well painted or not, if that makes any sense? Nmm can be done a lot more diversly so it opens up more oppertunity for painters to create the look they\'re going for.

Also....shouldn\'t this be in the painting & conversions thread?

hope thats helped a little bit.
 

Legacy Account

Active member
How do!

NMM vs. metallics discussion will bore most people shitless, but I think your assumption that metallics rate lower is unfounded.

Quality minis get quality scores. NMM is usually a technique people \'step-up\' to, even if it\'s just to test themselves, hence the paintjob on the rest of the mini is of a higher standard (generally speaking...).

Check out Cyril\'s Nurgle champion or anything by Jakob Nielsen to see \'high quality\' metallics..... (as opposed to just slapping on a bit of chainmail over boltgun!)
 

Legacy Account

Active member
How to get a good score with metallic paint....

img408d7192a123c.jpg


Another reason that just occured to me is that metallics don\'t photograph too well - they reflect light and this obscures the paintjob - not good on CMON!
 

supervike

Super Moderator
Also check out Tidoco2222 gallery.

He uses metallics quite a bit, almost exclusively

http://www.coolminiornot.com/browse/submitter/tidoco2222
 
I am not sure what it takes to make a mini a 7+. For me it\'s just a feel. The picture qualitly is also very important.

:( Sadly I am not so good with photo\'s. :(
 

TAB Studio

New member
It takes time, practice & being picky after a while the advancement comes naturally. Try getting a magnifying light to work under. If you can get used to it, I indeed could not work with out one but, that could be an age thing.
Also if you can post in the work in progress thread and ask others for help and opinions. I am often ranting this but it is true:D
 

Daft

New member
Sorry I put this in the wrong section. Kind of a nubie thing.

The thing is, how many times do you read a comment and it says \"if that is NMM you deserve a higher score.\" To which I say WHAT. If it looks like a level 8 mini it should be scored as one with or without NMM.:mad:
 

TAB Studio

New member
It is about the painting addiction ... not the score
When it is the (the addiction) you feed ..your scores rise without intervention or you adapting to the comments that frustrate you.
 

Daft

New member
Aaaaah!! That feels better. Submit to the addiction. Resistence is futile. I shall try painting in the lotus position for a while. That should make everything happier.

The frustrating thing is that I don\'t paint to get a better score. Rather I post to get feedback to improve my painting.

However, I\'ll bring this to a point where it can remain in this section of the forum.


Now these are currently rating about a 5.9, which is about what I expect. Yet one of the comments is \"If that is NMM these are very underrated.\" Now I scream. WHY?? Rate them for their appearance, not the technique used to gain that appearance.



cron2.jpg



23aff6b7.jpg



Scarab1.jpg
 

Brokenblade

New member
I understand completely what you are saying, it\'s quite a complex matter, i think yes, people should rate on what they see, but with these they look very smooth and realistic, and therefor the person is saying well done if they are done with nmm, since you\'ve achieved a good effect.

People seem to mark things as to how hard a techniques is, therefore if you have a model painted with a \"harder\" technique, the chances are it will rate higher, its a bit of a paradox but thats life.
 

frenchkid

New member
Originally posted by Daft
Sorry I put this in the wrong section. Kind of a nubie thing.

The thing is, how many times do you read a comment and it says \"if that is NMM you deserve a higher score.\" To which I say WHAT. If it looks like a level 8 mini it should be scored as one with or without NMM.:mad:

that\'s because it would mean the NMM is so good that it actually looks like metalic. Though I do agree with you that metalics shouldn\'t be rated lower then NMM. Truth is that\'s just the way CMON works, nothing we can do about it so you just have to accept it.
 

Infidel Castro

New member
And it all comes back to the most important question...do rankings/scores matter that much to you?

Those pieces look nice Daft, but carry on painting for yourself and your own fun. Balls to the scores lol
 

green stuff

Active member
Message original : reverend
And it all comes back to the most important question...do rankings/scores matter that much to you?
Creafigs used to have a rating system but they took it off because people couldn\'t stand getting less than 10 stars (on a maximum of 10 stars) :eek: !!! Now all the comments are along the line : Wow, great, marvelous, ... a lot of good that will do to get better IMHO ;).

Sure the rating system isn\'t as objectif as it could be, but I think it has its purpose (at least one can ask why a mini has such a score and get an answer to improve).
 

Legacy Account

Active member
The truth is that it takes a lot of skill to achieve a very realistic metallic effect without using metallic paint, so NMM will almost always score higher unless the metallics are fantastically well painted.

Those minis you posted look to be very decently painted, but your photos are somewhat lacking. The minis are too small and poorly lit. If you want an instant score increase, get some better pics and resubmit them. I reckon these would go up 0.5-1 point at least....

As for comments on your minis, you\'ll always get some dickhead say something you don\'t like.....:D
 

No Such Agency

New member
Originally posted by green stuff
Creafigs used to have a rating system but they took it off because people couldn\'t stand getting less than 10 stars (on a maximum of 10 stars) :eek: !!! Now all the comments are along the line : Wow, great, marvelous, ... a lot of good that will do to get better IMHO ;).
Yeah, I always felt sad for some of the people on Blackorc Games\' site - somebody would post a 5.5-6 paint job and all the comments would be along the lines of \"OMG!1!!1!one!1!eleven!! This should be a Golden Demon, look how perfect it is! Great job!\". Nobody\'s going to improve much that way - I was a pretty crappy painter until posting on CMON let me know how my work compared to the best possible achievements in this hobby. It has been a long struggle from 5-6 up to 8 though.
 

vincegamer

Active member
Originally posted by Daft
4=tabletop quality
5=Clean work with some nice basework
6=Clean work, nice basework, somethig stands out.

That is how I rate things
Since the site itself states that 5 is \"tabletop quality\" it seems you would be underrating things in most people\'s eyes.

I have only done 1 entry using NMM and it has not rated a 7, even though everyone who sees it says it is very good NMM. I think it requires more than good technique, but a good sculpt.
I can get a 7 if I set that as my goal. Just take a figure everyone likes and make sure your blends are smooth. Nothing special is necessary. That or do something that will make people laugh. Laughing people vote higher.

Those are my guesses based on my gallery.

edit - on second viewing of my own gallery I take it back. My NMM did reach 7 - and that with old HeroQuest orks.
 
J

JakeSh

Guest
Originally posted by No Such Agency
Originally posted by green stuff
Creafigs used to have a rating system but they took it off because people couldn\'t stand getting less than 10 stars (on a maximum of 10 stars) :eek: !!! Now all the comments are along the line : Wow, great, marvelous, ... a lot of good that will do to get better IMHO ;).
Yeah, I always felt sad for some of the people on Blackorc Games\' site - somebody would post a 5.5-6 paint job and all the comments would be along the lines of \"OMG!1!!1!one!1!eleven!! This should be a Golden Demon, look how perfect it is! Great job!\". Nobody\'s going to improve much that way - I was a pretty crappy painter until posting on CMON let me know how my work compared to the best possible achievements in this hobby. It has been a long struggle from 5-6 up to 8 though.

I hear ya. I paint a lot of Space Marimes, and I frequent the B&C (Bolter and Chainsword) Forum. The thing that I can\'t stand is that the worst mini can be posted and all it gets are good comments. Everyone is so obsessed about being nice to each other they can\'t leave any constructive criticism.
 

airhead

Coffin Dodger / Keymaster
A few hints on you minis:

Squads do not score as well as individual minis - IMHO it has to do with the amount of detail that we can see.

If you are using multiple views, stack them vertically instead of laying them out horizontially - again because we are limited to width of picture.

Your photo work has to be as good or better than your paint job. Look in my sig and find the \"brilliant\" clicky - Finn lies, but the link is great. I made mine from a window sheer curtain for less than $10.

Don\'t worry about your scores in the tenths of points. Look for long term improvement. Like NSA, I have struggled my way up from under 5\'s to mid 7\'s (he\'s painting 8\'s but I will some day too.)

Flesh tones and faces done well will improve your scores. The eyes make or break a humanoid mini. Robots generally don\'t score as well as humans.

Now, if you want to take this to a discussion about voting, we can dig up some of the old threads - but I would rather not.

MY standard (you are free to differ):
painted = 5 (tabletop)
blended well = up to +1
based well = up to +1
eyes = up to +1
originallity = up to +1
A good clean paint job decent blending and base gets about a 7 add a bit of pop and you are up to an 8, but the mini has to be photorealistic to get a 9 and breathing to get a 10 (I know I have given out a few of them but not more than a handfull)
 

Jambot13

New member
To get a 7+ you obviously have to be a decent enough painter, but you can help the mark up by including a combination of at least a couple of the following: detailed base, some freehand work, some conversion, quirky idea, miniature people like, NMM, lighting effect etc.

Good photography and a larger than actual size shot or multiple angles help too. All of these things only boost the mark if you do them well. Throw in all of those elements but don’t pull any of them off and you’ll just end up with a lower mark. Get them right and you’ll get a great mark...

That would be my response if I was being calculating about it, but to be honest I don’t work by this checklist, I don\'t apply specific criteria to the rating I give miniatures, and I try not to rate unless I have something interesting to say in a comment as well.

I decide how much I like a mini as a finished piece, and then try to place it on the scale. I take 5 as average quality, 7 as good, 9 as bloody brilliant and 10... well I rarely give 10s because it\'s perfection isn\'t it? If I give a 10 it means I think the mini is as close to perfection as I can imagine! I’ve given minis with less great paint jobs well above average marks because I like the pose, or the idea, and I’ve given amazingly painted minis rather low marks because they just don’t work for all kinds of reasons.

I suspect that many initially come to CMON to see what kind of mark their minis get and I also suspect that many people also feel that their miniatures are rated harshly. This was the case for me but after a short time it ceased to be my real motivation and I became more interested in getting better at painting than getting a better average mark.

At this point comments became much more useful than ratings, so I started to post links to my minis in these forums to really get some good constructive feedback.

As for your minis, I think unless you do a Necron in NMM they are always going to struggle to get a good mark because everyone’s seen so many of them. I personally like your guys. The colour scheme and different coloured gaus weaponry is cool, so it’s not a big issue that they aren’t NMM for me. They’re a clean, solid job. The problem is that no matter how clean the metallics are it is rather easy to paint metallic Necrons, so they’re a far from perfect showcase of your painting skill. On the other hand NMM Necrons are rather tricky (especially in that funky orange colour) and not seen so often, so they actually would be a blatantly awesome showcase of your painting skill, very different from the norm, and therefore underrated.

Hmm, did I just contradict myself... not sure... too many words... why do I always ramble like a tedious old man?
 
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