Golden demon entry - Basing rule clarification

[Pictish Mini Painting]

Hi folks,

I have started work on my entry for the Duel category at this years UK GD.

I have read through the rules of each entry, and it states that the models should be based on a 40 or 50mm base.

However my design is a bit unique and the method of fighting between the 2 combatants lends itself to having a bit of a gap of more than an inch.

Basically its a librarian marine firing lightning at a farseer with the farseer blocking it.

The plan is to base this on a 5" square scenic base and have the 2 characters on standard round bases with suitable terrain etc, so they can be removed from the scenic base to be judged etc, but i dont want to be discualified because i cant fit the 2 models on a 50mm base (as it would look daft).

Having had a look at previous Duel entries i have seen 2 models set farther apart than what a 50mm base would allow, but i dont want this to be classes as a diorama, as i am making a small entry for that category seperately as a bit of a wild card.

Can anyone clarify the requirement of the duel category, i.e. does it have to be on something the size of a large terminator base, or can i have them on their own sized bases with a gap?

Many thanks folks

 

[SkelettetS]

i believe you can play along pretty much ballistic with basing on the 40-50mm bases, as long as it looks suitable and you dont put a whole castle on it i think its no prob.

 

[ischa]

In the duel category(esp in uk) it´s really important to keep to the rules. 40/50mm and thats it. You shouldnt put them on their own bases, this wont go well with the idea of a small, fluent scene, where the models blend into the backdrop.

The fact that you´re restricted to a 50mm base wont hurt you though, as the scenery can be as big as you want, just look at this: http://demonwinner.free.fr/germany/2010/slayer_sword.php?p=300
It´s on a 50mm base, but the tiny base builds up into something huge!

 

[SkelettetS]

yeah, raffas piece is pretty massive for a duel

 

[10 ball]

Very important to keep to the rules for the UK GD

 

[Pictish Mini Painting]

That example above, helps me get an idea of base size.

I could use a warhammer square base to get a more stable\sizable platform to build on.

The main plan is to have the librarian standing on stairs doing the smite lightning, with the farseer deflecting it in a bubble.

I could build up part of the stairs onto the base and some tiles\rubble so there is the floor and lightning and 2 figures attached to the 50mm base (is that a terminator base in 40k or is there a bigger one?) then have that whole assembly fit into the scenic base, so its all modelled onto a built up 50mm base so can show the duel with the base touching the floor\desk etc, but can become a scene when placed into the scenic base.

Would this be within the rules? Because if i have to fit the models into an area not much bigger than say 3" square and have the base showing, it could be very tricky and basically look like i tried to get the models to fot rather than tell a story.

If i cant fathom something that works well, i will just have to enter the idea into diorama, which i dont want to do as the whole point of the scene and what is going on is essentialy a duel.

cheers

 

[RuneBrush]

That example above, helps me get an idea of base size.

I could use a warhammer square base to get a more stable\sizable platform to build on.

The main plan is to have the librarian standing on stairs doing the smite lightning, with the farseer deflecting it in a bubble.

I could build up part of the stairs onto the base and some tiles\rubble so there is the floor and lightning and 2 figures attached to the 50mm base (is that a terminator base in 40k or is there a bigger one?) then have that whole assembly fit into the scenic base, so its all modelled onto a built up 50mm base so can show the duel with the base touching the floor\desk etc, but can become a scene when placed into the scenic base.

Would this be within the rules? Because if i have to fit the models into an area not much bigger than say 3" square and have the base showing, it could be very tricky and basically look like i tried to get the models to fot rather than tell a story.

If i cant fathom something that works well, i will just have to enter the idea into diorama, which i dont want to do as the whole point of the scene and what is going on is essentialy a duel.

cheers

Judging with previous entries the critical element is that you have a "large infantry" sized base as the physical base that touches the display stand (yes that is terminator sized base). I do think that they employ "Rule 7 - Don't take the p!ss" too and move any that don't fit into the scope, into the diorama category. I think what you're suggesting of having a secondary scenic base could be seen as crossing the line. It sounds like you're not actually sure if you want to do a "duel" or a "scene of a duel" (aka a diorama)

 

[Pictish Mini Painting]

Have had a look at some entries from duel at previous GD's, i have a way i can do the same design, but working from a warhammer 50mm base on a plinth with a slightly widening column up to the area where they are duelling.

Wont be as nice a display, but will be within the rules and still give the effect.

Off to hobbycraft for some bits n bobs!

Thanks folks, saved me from a lot of work that could have been wasted

 

[RuneBrush]

Have had a look at some entries from duel at previous GD's, i have a way i can do the same design, but working from a warhammer 50mm base on a plinth with a slightly widening column up to the area where they are duelling.

Wont be as nice a display, but will be within the rules and still give the effect.

Off to hobbycraft for some bits n bobs!

Thanks folks, saved me from a lot of work that could have been wasted

Good luck! I'm doing a built up base for my Dreadnought entry, super sculpy and plasticard for the win!

 

[Pictish Mini Painting]

I have ended up going with this affair:

 

[RuneBrush]

That's really neat - what material is the black made from?

 

[Pictish Mini Painting]

The black material is foamboard, its the sort of stuff you sometimes get on pictures on wall, its a layer of card, then about a 1/2cm of highish density foam, then another layer of card.

I got it in Hobbycraft, it comes in black and white, in various sizes, you get 5 in a pck.

http://direct.hobbycraft.co.uk/products-West-Design-A4-Black-Foam-Board-x-5_313476.htm

You can get a cutter for it too to do 90 or 45 degree edge cuts too.

I am going to do flagstone style steps on the board using milliput rolled flat.

should look smart, hopefully catch a judges eye.

 

[RuneBrush]

I did think it might be foamboard, but you've cut the edges really cleanly so wasn't sure. Two words of warning though - firstly it will squash down with enough weight and secondly coat it with something as spray can's will eat the foam between the card layers.

 

[Pictish Mini Painting]

Way ahead of ya matey

I am going to put a thin piece of plasticard over the square (i.e. another layer) to prevent dents\squashing, and the edges i may make up edge strips from platic strips, or work out something with milliput. will see, may even use strips of electrical tape sliced on a ruler and scalpel, then tiny amounts of superglue to hold it.

Needs experimentation. The edge of the fibreboard was cut with a brand new scalpel blade and a steel rule, the new blade doesnt snatch the foam and tear it.

Cheers for the tips though, always good to get other folks input.

 

[RuneBrush]

Way ahead of ya matey

Cool beans!

I am going to put a thin piece of plasticard over the square (i.e. another layer) to prevent dents\squashing, and the edges i may make up edge strips from platic strips, or work out something with milliput. will see, may even use strips of electrical tape sliced on a ruler and scalpel, then tiny amounts of superglue to hold it.

A panel of plasticard on the top will make a load of difference actually - especially for gluing things on the top. Plasticard strips could work well round the edge - you can actually buy pre-cut strips, which although it seems extravagant is worth it as you know they're 100% the same width all the way down.

Needs experimentation. The edge of the fibreboard was cut with a brand new scalpel blade and a steel rule, the new blade doesnt snatch the foam and tear it.

Makes a huge difference doesn't it, though it is evil stuff and blunts your blade to spoon like sharpness within minutes Being able to cut straight down helps a lot too...

Cheers for the tips though, always good to get other folks input.

More than happy to interfere!

 

[Pictish Mini Painting]

Haha, i have the pre cut strips of plasticard already, will have a play about tonight.

I have mosaic squares for making a sort of paved\cobbled street.

I am doing this a bit arse about elbow, base first then model.

will keep posted.

 

[crystella333]

This is the one thing that always bugs me about GD. you get the ones that like Rose Model Art that do everything beforehand to make should she's right then you see past winners that have bend the rules as much as they can get away with like the bronze entry in this one http://demonwinner.free.fr/uk/2009/golden_demon_winner.php?categorie=8 beautiful models but I would have moved it into diorama instead of duel.

 

[Pictish Mini Painting]

This is the one thing that always bugs me about GD. you get the ones that like Rose Model Art that do everything beforehand to make should she's right then you see past winners that have bend the rules as much as they can get away with like the bronze entry in this one http://demonwinner.free.fr/uk/2009/golden_demon_winner.php?categorie=8 beautiful models but I would have moved it into diorama instead of duel.

Hang about..... I'm pretty sure I'm a chap! Hehe, spose it's easy mistake to make with the rose bit, but it's my last name, first names Rick lol.

You're right though, I am amazed people don't double check their entry rules

 

[Dragonsreach]

This is the one thing that always bugs me about GD.........you see past winners that have bend the rules as much as they can get away with....

I am amazed people don't double check their entry rules

If you look very closely you'll see that each entry stayed within the letter of the rules. Each entry was on either a 40 or 50mm round or square base.

What you are both talking about is the "Spirit of the rules", a totally different interpretation which has allowed Peoples imagination to develop the above mentioned entries.
If the rules stated "submissions in the duel category may not exceed the width of either a 40 or 50mm base" Then you'd find people going increasingly vertical and then the rules would get amended until you'd be left with a 50mm cube in which to work.

 

[crystella333]

@ Rose Model Arts. Sorry hun, that me making a ass of myself by assuming.

@ Dragonsreach: yeah I know its just one of the reasons why I'm too narrow minded at times. One day I'll lock away that bit of my mind that says its my way or the highway *wanders off to find a glass half full*