GW\'s Golden Deamon

[mabnkat]

Originally posted by mickc22

Originally posted by mabnkat
................................ But I was gutted as well, this was my first time entering and i don\'t know if i\'ll enter again... Its was the same with the forgeworld guys...they came round and didn\'t even look at the dame model :flame: I was gutted

this is the first time you\'ve entered and you\'re gutted you made the first cut? and with 2 minis?
plenty of others enter for years without even achieving that, be glad you got that, put them in a frame and hang \'em on your wall, use them to inspire you for next year

and I must ask why you painted it grey? It\'s not exactly a \"LOOK AT ME! I\'M OVER HERE!!\" kinda color really

I am happy with that..its the dodgy judging that i\'m talking about... And you say \" why paint it grey it doesnt shout look at me\" well the one of the winners was 90% brown.

Excellent models that did win by the way and again its not that i thought I SHOULD have won..its the judging.

 

[War Griffon]

No matter what the competition it will always have it\'s querks, be it a small painting comp or a major one, also it will have somebody that is not happy with the judges outcome.

We all have moments of hate for the judges but like a sport the referee\'s desission is final and that\'s that

It is all about what you expect and why you go there in the first place.

Last year was the 1st time I entered and ever went to a GD and I have been in the hobby since the 80\'s like a lot of people on here . I went last year to meet the other members of CMON theat I have become friendly with over the last few years, (I never bothered before because I couldn\'t be A**** to faff about on a coach with noisy brats and smelly kids all raving about the latest craze) the only reason I entered the demons was to get in early and not queue up with the noisy annoying :cussing: I went with the attitude of if I get to the finals great if not who cares, as it was last year I put in two entries one made finalist, the other didn\'t I was over the moon

This year I entered two again because somebody wouldn\'t let me enter the other Both made the finalists again over the moon the Fantasy Regiment I entered was never ever going to make the top three after all it is Warmaster (10mm scale) but that doesn\'t stop me entering them as I enjoy painting them and at the end of the day that is what it is all about.

 

[Cocanour]

I did not paint for a year after the first games day. I thought I was just that good. And it was not until I could look at my work and see the things that I needed to improve, that I got better. If you are making 1st cuts that is very good. Keep trying and us it to become better. In Chicago I did not place, I did make first cut, but being beat by AlexiZ and others is not such a bad thing if I am in the running with them. I just plan to try harder for next time.

 

[EricJ]

I think there are always going to be judging irregularities for a few reasons.

First, the judges are human, and everyone has differing oppinions about what makes something \"good\". Everyone has a different set of eyes, etc...

Second, we have to understand that there are \"political\" factors that go into judging. There are issues of wanting to promote sales of miniatures, and wanting to fill the pages of their magazine, so there are certain bias\' that creates

Third, what might jump off the page in photo is often different than what might stand out in person.

Personally I\'m still working to figure out how to paint for live competitions, it\'s a hard thing!

Like others have said, be proud of making the cut, that\'s an accomplishment, and there is no point in complaining about the results, because we could complain for 100 pages in these forums and it wouldn\'t change a thing.

 

[demonherald]

Agree with Eric there it\'s all down to personal tastes...

Also the lighting in the GD hall wasn\'t the best the bottom self minis from the beginning due to space available were nigh on shadows...

The table they put all the best of the cuts on was almost totally without light and the filming on the screens really made some models look sucky as sometimes close up photography does..

There is never any point complaining about judging unless you have a genuine complaint and act at the very moment it happens and you have evidence and witnesses.

there will always be controversey it just wouldn\'t be GD without it and if w all knew exactly what the judges were looking for and all painted and modelled exactly what they wanted and were expecting it would all be down to tastes again or something completely the opposite would win because it was different..

enjoy entering the competition and the day but if the result upsets ou then the comp simply isn\'t for you.......

 

[EricJ]

And always remember, character isn\'t defined by IF you win or lose, but rather how you act when you win or lose.

Don\'t give up because of the results, there are 100\'s of reasons to give up the hobby, and 100\'s of reasons not to, and the results of GD\'s probably shouldn\'t be on either list.

 

[tooshy]

I think the previous posts have kinda summed this up.

For a first time entrant, you did very well getting to the first cut - the standards were particularly high this year. You must bear in mind that a lot of extremely good painters have never won a demon and they have been attending GD for years.

It\'s good that you had high expectations and are rightly disappointed, but you need to take what you have learned about the process (if anything) and apply it to your next GD entry.

At the end of the day, whilst the \'voting process\' is important, it basically comes down to the luck of the draw on the day and to what catches the judges eye.

Despite your disappointment, I\'m pretty sure you\'ll enter again next year - we all do

 

[darkartminiatures]

Yep what tooshy and everyone one else has said. It was also a first for me and like war griffon i too was over the moon about getting finalist positions I saw this as a real bonus and i can\'t wait for next year as it has motivated me to raise my standards for this sort of thing.

Besides some of the best gw related painters in the world attend these things.

I only wish that i could of seen more of everyones work but it was just too busy. Maybe taking a can of dullcote into a crowd wasn\'t a bad idea after all

 

[MarkusTay]

This reminds me of the \'curious\' judging people were complaining about at the Cally GW a year or two ago, something about all the winners knowing the judges personally? I remember the winning models were only slightly above average if I recall. Ah well, memeory ain\'t what it used to be.

You all gave me an interesting idea though, if I ever enter I\'m going to slip $500 to a hot young stripper, bring her with me, and tell the judges if I win they win, Capeesh? Wonder what would happen? I wonder if they would know what to do with her? lol

 

[AinuLainour]

Originally posted by mabnkat

Originally posted by mickc22

Originally posted by mabnkat
................................ But I was gutted as well, this was my first time entering and i don\'t know if i\'ll enter again... Its was the same with the forgeworld guys...they came round and didn\'t even look at the dame model :flame: I was gutted

this is the first time you\'ve entered and you\'re gutted you made the first cut? and with 2 minis?
plenty of others enter for years without even achieving that, be glad you got that, put them in a frame and hang \'em on your wall, use them to inspire you for next year

and I must ask why you painted it grey? It\'s not exactly a \"LOOK AT ME! I\'M OVER HERE!!\" kinda color really

I am happy with that..its the dodgy judging that i\'m talking about... And you say \" why paint it grey it doesnt shout look at me\" well the one of the winners was 90% brown.

Brown can be very appealing, though grey is the easiest on the eyes, and the brain processes grey, over all colours quicker, making it less appealing. And Bloodthirsters aren\'t known for their frey skin...

 

[rocketandroll]

I have to concur with what was said about the lighting in the hall.... the slayer sword winning ork looked almost totally black/brown under harsh backlighting in that cabinet... but I\'ve since seen photos that show it in vibrant greens... you also really can\'t get close to the winning minis... not as close as the judges can get... and it\'s that \'right in your face\' final evaluation that almost certainly decides it...

I\'ve been working on my entries using the old Point Of Sale rules about grabbing people\'s attention at different distances in different ways... with GD I feel you need something that screams \'Look closer at me!\" from a few feet away in amoungst a swathe of similar coloured minis..... and then you need some detailing and subtlety once you get to the \'a few inches\' level to really make the judges jaws drop.

That\'s my 2p\'s worth anywho


Ben

 

[mabnkat]

Originally posted by AinuLainour

Originally posted by mabnkat

Originally posted by mickc22

Originally posted by mabnkat
................................ But I was gutted as well, this was my first time entering and i don\'t know if i\'ll enter again... Its was the same with the forgeworld guys...they came round and didn\'t even look at the dame model :flame: I was gutted

this is the first time you\'ve entered and you\'re gutted you made the first cut? and with 2 minis?
plenty of others enter for years without even achieving that, be glad you got that, put them in a frame and hang \'em on your wall, use them to inspire you for next year

and I must ask why you painted it grey? It\'s not exactly a \"LOOK AT ME! I\'M OVER HERE!!\" kinda color really

I am happy with that..its the dodgy judging that i\'m talking about... And you say \" why paint it grey it doesnt shout look at me\" well the one of the winners was 90% brown.

Brown can be very appealing, though grey is the easiest on the eyes, and the brain processes grey, over all colours quicker, making it less appealing. And Bloodthirsters aren\'t known for their frey skin...

Bloodthirster ain\'t real ! Whos says a model has to be this colour or that colour??

 

[GAR]

I know a couple of criteria they use in the GD.

One of them is \"Does this figure fit the background/established fluff?\"

Now there is a fair amount of how much do they adhere to this and I have noticed it varies from country to country, but in everycase, those that win look like something you might expect based on the fluff.

I suppose you could say your bloodthirster is an albino variation. However, even though it is well painted, and the wings are certainly eye catching, the rest of the figure does not measure up.

Still, to have made first cut is quite and achievement and nothing to be upset about.

When I went to my first GD in chicago this year, I was fortunate enough to win a silver and make a first cut as well. I have been floating on air for months on that, but like my friend cocanour (Brice) said, losing to AlexiZ is nothing to be ashamed of.

Now all I can figure is I would have done much better if all the ppl that beat me would not have showed up ...or...if I painted better. I think the later is easier since I can\'t keep all the really good painters home so I can win, unless I start sending out the bribes now. hmmm...:drunk:

 

[AinuLainour]

Originally posted by GAR
... losing to AlexiZ is nothing to be ashamed of.

Or losing to GAR, Alexi, and Jamie like me :beer:

 

[Sister of Silence]

Judging

Originally posted by rocketandroll

I\'ve been working on my entries using the old Point Of Sale rules about grabbing people\'s attention at different distances in different ways... with GD I feel you need something that screams \'Look closer at me!\" from a few feet away in amoungst a swathe of similar coloured minis..... and then you need some detailing and subtlety once you get to the \'a few inches\' level to really make the judges jaws drop.

My husband employed that idea this year. He did a bloodthirster that was all hot and magma-y (if you saw it in 40K Monster). Not only did it scream from a few feet away, being bright hot colours on a shelf which was predominently brown, but when you get in close the armour is covered in freehand faces. He spent about 200 hours on it (most of them spent staying up all night, and me staying up to keep the coffee flowing) and although it made the first cut, it wasn\'t placed.:flame:

It certainly put doubt into my mind as to whether the judges can actually see. Still, it hasn\'t defeated us (that which does not kill us will only make us more determined) and we\'ll be back next year with more than one entry this time!

 

[Avicenna]

Originally posted by Sister of Silence
It certainly put doubt into my mind as to whether the judges can actually see.

No, I think they can see perfectly well, I think they just have their own taste and far too many deserving winners that someone is always going to be disappointed. I think it also shows that no matter how technically perfect a paint-job might be, or how many hundreds of hours spent painting it, so much relies on luck on the day.

Its a shame really, but I think to really have a better chance of winning you\'d need to compete in 7 or 8 categories spending maybe less time on the models, but trying to beat the competition on the luck stakes! Thats going to be my game-plan next year!

 

[chrismisterx]

I was at GD < didnt finish my minis to enter >, and over all I was disappointed.

It was hard for me to see the minis, and the TV\'s didnt do the minis justice.

That aside, I have a question, in the open comp, am I right that 3 GW staff won again ?

To be honest i paint for me, credit, feedback etc is always a bonus, I will enter next year so my minis can be seen in the cabnet by lots of people, thats my aim, anything else is a bonus

 

[War Griffon]

Yes it was 3 members of staff that won the open demons.

 

[Sister of Silence]

I don\'t have a problem with staff winning the Open - that was why it was created in the first place. If it wasn\'t there, then staff would be penalised unfairly. I mean, they are the biggest hobbyists amongst us, seeing as they are trying to carve a career out of this most wonderful, most soul-destroying game.

On the other hand, I do sometimes feel that maybe the Slayer Sword winner should have been in that category, being a brand new sculpt. I mean, the funky slug in 40K monster was penalised for not containing enough Citadel stuff - why wasn\'t this one?

Anyway, next year we\'re going to go for at least three categories each (none of which are going to involve huge models), and start them in March to ensure that each one fgets the time it deserves and we actually get to sleep before the day!

 

[War Griffon]

Other people enter the open besides the staff though as it is the only place they can put converted/self sculpted models and various other choices, a few of these entries were a lot better than some of the winners so the other side of the coin here is why should other people be penalised because GW want to give recognition to it\'s staff painters???

If this is the case then why don\'t they have a seperate class for only GW staff to enter and maybe a masterclass category for all other entries that do not fit the other categories but do follow the GW theme.