Have you seen this?

[Ebonbuddha]

But they did work to fix it. If they didn\'t there wouldn\'t be an America. And that’s the point. Try learning a skill. I am trying to do that. Something that will help me get a good or better job. My friend and his wife (who is also a friend of mine) from Korea went home (Toronto) last year. They didn\'t plan for anything. They just dropped in and expected things to be the god. When his wife got there all she did was bitch about how Korean food wasn\'t cheap like it is back home. The weather was bad in Canada and Korea had good weather. The cities in Canada and America were stupid because they were named after places in Europe. Korea has all original names.

The truth?
Western food is expensive here. But that is what happens when you export things. Of course she said that wasn\'t true. Everything in Korea was cheaper than in North America.

Yes, it gets cold in Canada. But Korean summers are insanely hot. There are also the yellow dust storms from China. You can go weeks without seeing the sun here.

And the originality of Korea is disappearing everyday. You can walk outside and see \"New York Academy\" \"New York, New York\" restaurants that serve Korean food, the Gap that has nothing to do with the actual company. The Korean language is phonetic. It is easy to make an English word by using the Korean alphabet. So a lot of people will take an American city or American company and name their company it. But a lot of people don\'t notice unless they can read Korea. I can.

Now on the other hand another friend from here married an American and she is living in California. When she got to the States, she took an ESL course and went to nursing school. She has graduated and is waiting to be assigned to a hospital. California has some kind of lottery system. Another guy who works with my wife married a Korean girl and went back home to Toronto and learned a skill that would help her. That’s the difference.
That’s what I think people are complaining about. People not being prepared and blaming everything on teh people in the country. Be prepared, just in case. I am still thinking about taking more courses when we get home since I might not be getting a job right away. But thanks to Airhead’s advice I am preparing.

I have enjoyed Our discussion though Dr. Evilmonki.

Originally posted by DrEvilmonki
Ah yes, the name of the party is New Zealand First.

I hope you don\'t get me wrong, I am not saying America has a worse history than anyone else. What I am saying is that in VERY general terms is that America actively tries to portray itself as being more open and tolerant than everyone else but it is often not backed up by it\'s actions.


The early settlers DID complain a lot by the way and in fact the first American pilgrims almost died out because they did not want to change their lifestyle to suit the local conditions. Some in fact wrote that they believed the land was cursed.

And the point about the doctors is still the same - why tell people that they can immigrate because they have a degree but then refuse to accept the same degree when they arrive? It seems disingenuous.

 

[supervike]

I need to clarify my above statement.

My only point was aimed at the website EB showed. The country the immigrants came from was decidedly worse, yet the country that has accepted them seems no better. That\'s why I use the term sour grapes. If they get the right to moan about it, I get the damn right to moan about their moaning! My point about building their Utopia was one of irony. Their home country sucks so bad that they COULDN\'T fix it....Thats why they leave.

My mid-sized city has seen a large influx of Bosnians and Mexicans over the past 15 years. None of them stole my job. None of them stole my women. I haven\'t had a single problem with any person. From my experience they are hard working folks just trying to make themselves a decent life. They have as much claim on \'my city\' as I do. All I would ask is that they are here legally and pay their taxes when due.

I know that they are discriminated against, but what should I do about it? I\'ve never seen in personally happen. To blame me for that would be as asinine as blaiming me for slavery in the US, or taking the American Indians land.

It seems a bit skewed to complain about grouping \'these people\' together, yet you have no qualms about grouping \'Americans\' together as a bunch of racist anti-immigrant zealots.

 

[LavronYor]

What\'s up with number 3, NO Culture?NO Canadian food?

What is Canadian Bacon, and what about French fries with cottage cheese and gravy at Tim Horton\'s?

And let\'s not forget, Horseshoe Falls kicks ass on Niagara Falls.

And do they not have successful get rich quick schemes up there?

Bummer....

 

[Ebonbuddha]

Well put SV.

Originally posted by supervike
I need to clarify my above statement.

My only point was aimed at the website EB showed. The country the immigrants came from was decidedly worse, yet the country that has accepted them seems no better. That\'s why I use the term sour grapes. If they get the right to moan about it, I get the damn right to moan about their moaning! My point about building their Utopia was one of irony. Their home country sucks so bad that they COULDN\'T fix it....Thats why they leave.

My mid-sized city has seen a large influx of Bosnians and Mexicans over the past 15 years. None of them stole my job. None of them stole my women. I haven\'t had a single problem with any person. From my experience they are hard working folks just trying to make themselves a decent life. They have as much claim on \'my city\' as I do. All I would ask is that they are here legally and pay their taxes when due.

I know that they are discriminated against, but what should I do about it? I\'ve never seen in personally happen. To blame me for that would be as asinine as blaiming me for slavery in the US, or taking the American Indians land.

It seems a bit skewed to complain about grouping \'these people\' together, yet you have no qualms about grouping \'Americans\' together as a bunch of racist anti-immigrant zealots.

 

[Thecadian]

if were talking about people comeing here what about all the people on the uk or usa that emigrate themselves my next door neighbour went to france last year.

not to mention all the people who own second homes in europe making it hard for the people who live there to buy houses.

i think having people come over to the uk is a good idea.the NHS wouldnt work without all the foreign people here.

it is possable to come to another country and get good jobs my dentists indian.

 

[Avelorn]

Originally posted by supervike
I need to clarify my above statement.

My only point was aimed at the website EB showed. The country the immigrants came from was decidedly worse, yet the country that has accepted them seems no better. That\'s why I use the term sour grapes. If they get the right to moan about it, I get the damn right to moan about their moaning! My point about building their Utopia was one of irony. Their home country sucks so bad that they COULDN\'T fix it....Thats why they leave.

Yep.. and I\'ve got the right to moan that you moan about that they moan. As I\'ve said, it doesn\'t depends how much my homecountry sucks. It is a irrelevant factor for how much crap I should have to stand in my new country.

My mid-sized city has seen a large influx of Bosnians and Mexicans over the past 15 years. None of them stole my job. None of them stole my women. I haven\'t had a single problem with any person. From my experience they are hard working folks just trying to make themselves a decent life. They have as much claim on \'my city\' as I do. All I would ask is that they are here legally and pay their taxes when due.

Great I\'m glad you haven\'t had any problems.

I know that they are discriminated against, but what should I do about it? I\'ve never seen in personally happen. To blame me for that would be as asinine as blaiming me for slavery in the US, or taking the American Indians land.

There are several things we can do about it. We can raise it to discussion, we can kill myths, we can even encourage our politicians. But.. it\'s difficult, I agree. I surely don\'t do enough. Blaming people isn\'t my cup of tea and I didn\'t put any blame on anyone in what I wrote above as the cause of discrimination. But there is a difference between something happening today and something that has happened in the past..

It seems a bit skewed to complain about grouping \'these people\' together, yet you have no qualms about grouping \'Americans\' together as a bunch of racist anti-immigrant zealots.

Hmm.. have I in above statement said anything about Americans in general? Or any other country in general? To be honest I didn\'t even think of America when I typed it.. I read the statements in this thread and reacted to them.. nothing else. I don\'t view America or americans as a whole that I can have a unified opinion about.

But even if I make the same stupid mistakes (which I of course do all the time), it is also irrelevant for the discussion as it doesn\'t depend whether I have prejudices or not.

 

[Ebonbuddha]

I agree about not taking crap. But when you complain about some of the insane stuff, you tend to get annoyed. Read my earlier post about some of the complaints my friend had about Canada. It’s silly really.

I went to Singapore a few years ago. When I went there I knew I wasn\'t going to chew gum, spit on the sidewalks, or write graffiti. Did I complain? No. I just didn’t spit, or chew gum. I’m not one for graffiti.

Not to mention if you move to the States or Canada, you can also apply for a work visa. Maybe it would have been a good idea to see if you will need a higher standard for that country. And you also never hear about immigrants who succeed. I will be one of those. There is no try, only do. So yeah, its not always the host country being biggoted. it is also the person.

Originally posted by Avelorn

Yep.. and I\'ve got the right to moan that you moan about that they moan. As I\'ve said, it doesn\'t depends how much my homecountry sucks. It is a irrelevant factor for how much crap I should have to stand in my new country.

 

[supervike]

Originally posted by Avelorn

Originally posted by supervike
I need to clarify my above statement.

My only point was aimed at the website EB showed. The country the immigrants came from was decidedly worse, yet the country that has accepted them seems no better. That\'s why I use the term sour grapes. If they get the right to moan about it, I get the damn right to moan about their moaning! My point about building their Utopia was one of irony. Their home country sucks so bad that they COULDN\'T fix it....Thats why they leave.

Yep.. and I\'ve got the right to moan that you moan about that they moan. As I\'ve said, it doesn\'t depends how much my homecountry sucks. It is a irrelevant factor for how much crap I should have to stand in my new country.

My mid-sized city has seen a large influx of Bosnians and Mexicans over the past 15 years. None of them stole my job. None of them stole my women. I haven\'t had a single problem with any person. From my experience they are hard working folks just trying to make themselves a decent life. They have as much claim on \'my city\' as I do. All I would ask is that they are here legally and pay their taxes when due.

Great I\'m glad you haven\'t had any problems.

I know that they are discriminated against, but what should I do about it? I\'ve never seen in personally happen. To blame me for that would be as asinine as blaiming me for slavery in the US, or taking the American Indians land.

There are several things we can do about it. We can raise it to discussion, we can kill myths, we can even encourage our politicians. But.. it\'s difficult, I agree. I surely don\'t do enough. Blaming people isn\'t my cup of tea and I didn\'t put any blame on anyone in what I wrote above as the cause of discrimination. But there is a difference between something happening today and something that has happened in the past..

It seems a bit skewed to complain about grouping \'these people\' together, yet you have no qualms about grouping \'Americans\' together as a bunch of racist anti-immigrant zealots.

Hmm.. have I in above statement said anything about Americans in general? Or any other country in general? To be honest I didn\'t even think of America when I typed it.. I read the statements in this thread and reacted to them.. nothing else. I don\'t view America or americans as a whole that I can have a unified opinion about.

But even if I make the same stupid mistakes (which I of course do all the time), it is also irrelevant for the discussion as it doesn\'t depend whether I have prejudices or not.

Ah...well...Some of that wasn\'t directed at you, or your post, but to some of the other posts.

Anyhow, you raise excellent points. I understand what you say, and I am sympathetic to much of it.

Also, just to reiterate, there are immigrants that do exceedingly well in this country (and I assume Canada as well). A large number of the doctors we have are not American born, for instance. But that doesn\'t mean barriers do not exist for these people. Its a tough row to hoe, coming to a strange land and trying to fit it.

 

[DrEvilmonki]

@Supervike. I do apologise. You are right I have in this (and other) thread generalized about \"Americans\". I guess that does show a certain skewed view about your country and it\'s people.
I know to a degree why but to be honest I don\'t think there are any VALID reasons, just assumptions based on limited information and exposure to anything except media representations.

My interaction with the fine people on these forums is certainly helping me get a better perspective and also making me think more about what I type.

 

[Ebonbuddha]

And we all lived happily ever after.

If I still drank, I would say let have a beer. The Doc is buying.

 

[supervike]

Originally posted by DrEvilmonki
@Supervike. I do apologise.

No need for that!! Half the charm of this site is us disagreeing with each other.

The thing is, all of us seem to have more in common than not.

:beer: