No GW blisters in stores...

[the alleycat]

the \'Flat\' plastics were designed with box sets in mind [still are if you check out the new warhammer,] they needed to lay flat.

The other issues were plastics technology, it was dificult to get the results they do now from plastics consistantly. The big thing though was the cost of getting plastic kit moulds made. It still costs a fortune, though comparatively less, though now they can computer model the three ups and make the far more complicated kits you\'ve seen over the last few years.

 

[lono]

Originally posted by Evil Dave
I\'m not disputing what you were told. However, it makes one wonder, that if the whole poseability and individuality concept was their plan from the get go, then why did they switch from multipart \"beakies\" to the three part plastic marines, the two part Orks, and the two part Eldar in second edition, it seems like that was a major step backwards. The older, cheaper models where far more poseable/individual than those.

That one would partly be down to the limitations of the plastic technology at the time I guess. Also although they were in less parts they were far more detailed than the beakies. I wasn\'t with GW then though, my employment was much more recent, but if attitudes then were the same as now they would also have wanted sets with fewer parts for beginers. The weight issue as well I suppose. You couldn\'t pack a core game box with lead like you could with plastic.

Why were the first Dreads in plastic exactly the same as the Dreads in metal, the first Plastic Dreads came with almost none of the stuff in the sprues you see today, yet they cost the same as the metal ones did, as did the first plastic bikes and the first plastic landspeeders? They were no more unique or more poseable than the metals were.

For me the plastics were instantly more unique and poseable. I could convert the dread, and the speeders and bikes were far more realistic looking, and much larger and more impressive than the metal equivalents.

If you may recall, the only way to get individuality then was to buy the metal marines, with plastic arms and shoulders.

True, that was a bit of a bummer! Not sure why, a temporary mis-step in the release schedule?

I think if you look into the history you are probably right, the plastics weren\'t that great for a while, but that period meant that now the technology is really advanced and there are some really great plastic kits around. Maybe that is why the selling point is now that the kits offer variation and quality rather than they are cheeper. They have realised that is the benefit of plastics.

 

[Evil Dave]

Originally posted by lono
I think if you look into the history you are probably right, the plastics weren\'t that great for a while, but that period meant that now the technology is really advanced and there are some really great plastic kits around. Maybe that is why the selling point is now that the kits offer variation and quality rather than they are cheeper. They have realised that is the benefit of plastics.

See, and that is were a lot of us old timers stand, we were there for the metals and remember the crappy plastics.

The new stuff does look good, however, many of us can\'t/won\'t deal with the prices.

ie. I was looking today at GW\'s online store and looking at the new Eldar Fire Dragons, 5 fire Dragons and an Exarch=$30 US, I cannot justify to myself spending $5.00 (more including shipping) a miniature for plastic miniatures, I just can\'t.
Wraithguard are even worse at $15.00 each.
I mean hell, there are quite a few Non GW models out there three times the size, just as much detail, and a fraction of the cost.

 

[angus147258]

I agree with that.
What I don\'t understand is why stores that have the room can\'t keep selling what they have been and other smaller stores just choose not to stock all of the models and just have the customers order what they want through them?
Jake

 

[DrEvilmonki]

Originally posted by Evil Dave

Originally posted by lono
I think if you look into the history you are probably right, the plastics weren\'t that great for a while, but that period meant that now the technology is really advanced and there are some really great plastic kits around. Maybe that is why the selling point is now that the kits offer variation and quality rather than they are cheeper. They have realised that is the benefit of plastics.

See, and that is were a lot of us old timers stand, we were there for the metals and remember the crappy plastics.

The new stuff does look good, however, many of us can\'t/won\'t deal with the prices.

ie. I was looking today at GW\'s online store and looking at the new Eldar Fire Dragons, 5 fire Dragons and an Exarch=$30 US, I cannot justify to myself spending $5.00 (more including shipping) a miniature for plastic miniatures, I just can\'t.
Wraithguard are even worse at $15.00 each.
I mean hell, there are quite a few Non GW models out there three times the size, just as much detail, and a fraction of the cost.

Well I\'m one of those old timers and I don\'t stand anywhere near there.

I honestly can\'t see what difference it makes to you if a figure is made of metal or plastic, it\'s physical component makes up a minimum of the price. Design, molds, packaging shipping and store costs would be 90+% of the cost either way so any saving you may have expected is illusory really.

Unless you are planning on selling your figures to a scrap metal merchant if times get tough I think you will find both metal and plastic are basically equal for the sake of game play (metal figures don\'t have a higher toughness you know )

 

[Sand Rat]

Originally posted by the alleycat
the \'Flat\' plastics were designed with box sets in mind [still are if you check out the new warhammer,] they needed to lay flat.

The other issues were plastics technology, it was dificult to get the results they do now from plastics consistantly. The big thing though was the cost of getting plastic kit moulds made. It still costs a fortune, though comparatively less, though now they can computer model the three ups and make the far more complicated kits you\'ve seen over the last few years.

Umm - Bullshit. I\'ve been building plastic model kits for the last 30 years, and have 30 year old kits that look better than the most recent stuff that GW has put out in plastic - Airfix, Tamiya, Italiari, et al have been able to get consistant quality from their product (yes I know Airfix is bankrupt right now) for that time frame, so what is GW\'s issue with it? Yes, the molds are more expensive than with the metal models, but they last one hell of a lot longer (I\'ve got kits that were produced from molds that were originally made in the 1950\'s), so in the long run, that cost can be recouped.

I bought some GW plastics about 2 years ago - the McCragge Set, an Empire Battalion, and a Lizardman Battalion - and honestly the plastic quaility sucks rocks. I\'ve got water bottle lids that are stiffer - and I can gouge the plastic with my fingernails - this is how GW is going to save the industry?

 

[AinuLainour]

Steel, firstly, Macragge is a beginner\'s kit so the quality isn\'t mean\'t be quite as high as the box-set is sold for a \"low price\".

Secondly, the plastic box-sets that GW is creating now with the countless options and \'accessories\' aren\'t the battalions, well, at least not yet.

They are the plastic Giant, the plastic Dragon to be released in the next little while, and the Baneblade.

 

[Sand Rat]

And this changes the fact that plastic kits have been out there for oh at least 10 years longer than I have been extant on the planet and had better quaility of sculpt 20 years ago than GW has now how Ainu?

 

[AinuLainour]

The sculpt quality with the Giant, Baneblade and Dragon are the best large models that GW has put out in a long time. Loads of detail, pieces that fit easier, much larger models...

 

[Sand Rat]

That may be true but this seems to me to be another case of GW trying to reinvent the wheel, instead of looking at what another industry has done and using that as its basis -

And some GW kits are in the same price range as models with turned aluminium barrels and photo etched details - but this is better for a gamer how?

 

[supervike]

Originally posted by Evil Dave

I really do think aquiring Lord of the Rings is going to bite them in the ass though.

Maybe...but maybe when Peter Jackson decides to do the HOBBIT or the SILMARILLION, GW will be laughing all the way to the bank.

 

[MarkusTay]

But what new mini\'s will they be able to produce with the Hobbit?

They\'ve already done Tom Bombadil, and many of the other Hobbit-only figures. They have gandalf, Bilbo, and Gollum... all they need to do is make some more dwarves. I don\'t think it will expand the line enough Vike, unless they do Smaug.

Now that would be neat.

Unless you think the new movie will stimulate sales? But I think the latest LotR fever is over; it\'ll be another 20 years before it comes back around.

 

[Evil Dave]

Originally posted by supervike

Originally posted by Evil Dave

I really do think aquiring Lord of the Rings is going to bite them in the ass though.

Maybe...but maybe when Peter Jackson decides to do the HOBBIT or the SILMARILLION, GW will be laughing all the way to the bank.

Heh, I don\'t think anyone can do the Silmarillion.

 

[james sequeira]

The Hobbit Discussions are still on and GW need a cash cow now.

I prefer to buy metal minis simply because plastic is worthless

 

[matty1001]

Originally posted by Evil Dave

Originally posted by supervike

Originally posted by Evil Dave

I really do think aquiring Lord of the Rings is going to bite them in the ass though.

Maybe...but maybe when Peter Jackson decides to do the HOBBIT or the SILMARILLION, GW will be laughing all the way to the bank.

Heh, I don\'t think anyone can do the Silmarillion.

And theve produced the battle of the five army\'s game, so that pretty much covers The Hobbit (albeit at 15mm scale)

 

[generulpoleaxe]

lotr still makes them a lot of profit.
(maybe not in america)

most lotr metal mins are single piece and being so you can fit more in a master.
this drops casting costs and helps with profit.

lotr minis look better imo than most 40k or warhammer minis nowadays anyway.

 

[DrEvilmonki]

Originally posted by james sequeira
The Hobbit Discussions are still on and GW need a cash cow now.

I prefer to buy metal minis simply because plastic is worthless

And metal minis have an intrinsic value? Give me a break.

 

[Trevor]

It was 30 RTB01 marines for 9.99, and 3 rhinos for the same price.

Those new eldar fire dragons are metal not plastic...

The regiment and up box sets are really pretty good value, works out at around 1 pound a mini or thereabouts. Now I remember buying minis back in the mid 80s and it was 50p for a metal mini, single metals are now around 3 pounds, so in 20 years I would say plastics have kept the price down, both compared to earlier plastics and compared to metals.

Also bear in mind that they now tend to give you ALL the options in the box. I can\'t tell you how frustrating it used to be not being able to get all the available options.

Finally, I\'m sick and tired of all the GW hating. Go buy something else if you don\'t like it. Personally I think they are really getting it right with their product now. And if it really is to expensive for you to buy new, there is always ebay, or numerous trading sites.

:drunk:

 

[hashmallum]

Yeah 1 GW plastic Dreadnought for space marines costs the same as starter for Warmachine (2 large warjacks 1 caster , or 3 small warjacks, 1 large + caster , or 2 medium warjacks, 1 large + caster
I have chosen the second option - bye bye GW

 

[philologus]

It would be great if they could do the Silmarillion. There are tons of characters and interesting fodder for models there. I\'m with Genrealpoleaxe. I like the look of the LOTR minis. I talked with some GW staff last year and was told that (at that time) the box of plastic Uruk-Hai troops was their best-selling product in the US. I don\'t know how true that is but it seems LOTR is still making them some cash.