What in the hell are they thinking?

[Dragonsreach]

Originally posted by reverend
Drop \'romantic\' for \'funny\' and I\'ll agree with you there.

Try reading Jane Austen, there\'s a lot of subtle wit and dry humour in Pride and Prejudice.

As to the GW components issue I was there on Wednesday trying to get some pieces for Ebonbhudda and some simple pieces for myself......Sh*t outta luck.
While I can understand the rationalisation of reducing some 200,000 stock line items of low turnaround back into useable (ie profitable) pewter it\'s still a heavy handed approach and really dismissive of part of their customer base.

 

[Sand Rat]

We are talking about the same company that revamps their entire line every few years - after you\'ve put in several thousand dollars, not to mention hours worked, and makes it all illegal to play?

For years GW hasn\'t been interested in keeping the people who are buying their stuff - all they want is the new business, not the repeat business, imo. So what do they care if they piss off the old gamers? There\'s always some 14 yr old goth wanna be with too much disposable income that will buy their stuff.

 

[War Griffon]

What amazes me is that when you order the stuff before you never had to wait for it, you ordered it you got it now all of a sudden they have stopped the bitz line completely so this must mean that they have 200,000 odd bitz just sat in a bin doing nothing but gathering dust or have they melted it all back down again???

Surely keeping it on the books until it was gone or putting into packs like they have done with 2 or 3 parts would make better financial sense.

Hmmm, just re-read this and spotted my deliberate mistake - GW and sense lol

 

[Friar]

One thing I don\'t think has been mentioned yet is they aren\'t trying to stop bwb from selling bits they just want the online shopping cart removed, and while that makes it a bit of a pain the worse it\'ll come to is you have to call and place the order. A pain in the ass yes but atleast it\'ll still be there.

and I\'ll agree with steelcult GW doesn\'t really care about repeat customers as much as new ones, and in a sick way they punish their loyal customers by doing their practice of forcing them to completely redo armies every few years.

 

[Shadzar]

Originally posted by Bengoodall
I think at the end of the day its all just going to end up with GW suddenly realising how much of their own market they have destroyed, and that suddenly their stock price is worth nothing, and they are out of business.

well at least Gav Thorpe is leaving GW.

 

[Bengoodall]

Shad, you have no idea how happy I am about that.

Given Im pissed off about everything else though, thats not too hard.

I guess the question is really, are they likely to reverse this at some point, and start paying attention to older customers, or are they just going to go further and further down the line of let the young kids buy it, grow sick of it, and chuck it.

Its just a case of theyve sold themselves out.

 

[Roger Bunting]

Well, that list you can download is supposedly just the start, there will be more releases and bitz packs. Of course, that still means there will apparently be no way to buy just the one bit you need from them.

 

[Ebonbuddha]

Yeah. But I don\'t need five nemesis force weapons.

What happens when you have four extra of something?

You sell the extras. There is no logic to their decision. lol

 

[Sand Rat]

Originally posted by Bengoodall
I guess the question is really, are they likely to reverse this at some point, and start paying attention to older customers, or are they just going to go further and further down the line of let the young kids buy it, grow sick of it, and chuck it.

From current experience, which do you think is most likely?:drunk:

 

[Shadzar]

Originally posted by Bengoodall
Shad, you have no idea how happy I am about that.

Given Im pissed off about everything else though, thats not too hard.

I guess the question is really, are they likely to reverse this at some point, and start paying attention to older customers, or are they just going to go further and further down the line of let the young kids buy it, grow sick of it, and chuck it.

Its just a case of theyve sold themselves out.

trends are showing that repeat customers is not what the market cares aobut. only new customers. take a look at WotC and what Hasbro allows them to do. D&D is currently trying to follow the trend of Warhammer. new entire ruleset every 3-4 years. older gamers outmoded for a younger crowd. even the games are geared towards younger players.

so if the other majog gaming company is following GW then i don\'t see any reason for GW to switch unless they jsut want to be different, and actually care about former customers.

maybe that is what they are doing by cleaning house. restructuring internally to make the game better. but for those that don\'t play the game they still fail with the removal of bit. they might as well let Revelle make and sell models for them as whole packs. cause we know how well that market is doing just by looking in your local toy section and seeing maybe one model move per month or week on a good note.

im probably through playing the games so it doesn\'t matter to me much either way. i can jsut wish these companies will take people into consideration and stop worshipping at the alter of the $. without people they get no $\'s.

it all has an AOL feel to me. like why AOL is now free because they ticked off too many people and they went elsewhere. but sicne AOL isn\'t a game they probably cannot make the correlation between cause and effect.

 

[Bengoodall]

Cult - yeah, silly question of me there, I have been having these flushes of severe hope lately.

I go back on the heavier medication next week.

Shads - its that whole problem of the people who grew the company, and loved the game, have sold the company to people who dont.

And the people who now run it dont know anything other than to get down on all fours and worship.

Ill stop there before I earn myself a ban

But then Im balancing that against the falling stock price, on the assumption (makes an ASS out of U and Me....) that any management with any brain (ok, now Im really pushing it here) will try to reverse that, and raise the stock price again.

Anyone got any up to date figures for that?

 

[Sand Rat]

Originally posted by Shadzar
trends are showing that repeat customers is not what the market cares aobut. only new customers. take a look at WotC and what Hasbro allows them to do. D&D is currently trying to follow the trend of Warhammer. new entire ruleset every 3-4 years. older gamers outmoded for a younger crowd. even the games are geared towards younger players.

Ok, everyone who knows me well here is going to be looking for a pod because I\'m going to partially defend GW here -

I\'ve been playing D&D for about 30 years now - in that time I\'ve seen 6 or 7 different versions of D&D come out - the original Chainmail, D&D first Ed (1977-1978), D&D the dumbed down edition (Basic as its own separate non compatable version (1983?), Second Ed (85ish), modified 2nd Ed (90ish), Third Edition, 3.5, and now 4.0.

Since as a company TSR predates GW by years, GW did not conceive this business model in the industry. And hell, when you get right down to it TSR didn\'t invent it either - its called planned obsolescence and was pioneered by the Auto industry here in the US on a large scale. The difference is that GM and Ford don\'t do everything in their power to piss off their client base - they want you to buy a new car every 5-10 years, and continue to make parts for older vehicles or allow the sale of parts by others for extremely old vehicles. They do not try to stop the sale of parts through anyone but themselves, which is what GW seems to be doing here.

 

[Bengoodall]

But why cant the heads at GW see that?

Are they really that far up themselves?

 

[Sand Rat]

Part of the problem is we look at the hobby from a hobbiests perspective - where as they are looking at ti from the business perspective and they don\'t see the loss of long time stability as a bad thing, as long as they are making sales to compensate for the loss of the repeat business.

After all how many times has someone here said that GW is the largest mini producer world wide?

 

[airhead]

Originally posted by steelcult
...and continue to make parts for older vehicles or allow the sale of parts by others for extremely old vehicles. They do not try to stop the sale of parts through anyone but themselves, which is what GW seems to be doing here.

And keep in mind that if you bought a $20k car by parts, it would cost well over $100k.
There is an economy in packaging. If GW were to sell bits at $1 a bit, that would not bee too outrageous if we compaired it back to the auto industry model.

This would make them available to us and still profitable to GW. (if any of their people read any of this.....)

 

[vincenti]

A SAD FACT OF LIFE !

I am GUTTED by the lack of spares :no: :|~ !
But in a rare moment of sanity I suppose it maKes sense to streamline the buisiness this way.
I have been informed that as things get better more spares will become available.
The sad fact is, we as miniaturists are only a small minority of G.W.s client base .

Their priority as a buisiness is making money,not facilitating the needs of a niche market . Oh how I hate reality some times !

GOD bless ...............VINCENTI

 

[Ebonbuddha]

Unfortunately, I know what Steelcult is talking about. I remember the early versions of D&D. I owned the original blue boxset (77-78?). It came with the Isle of Dread module.

Steelcult is right about planned obsolescence. I took a computer course a long time ago. The instructor said that if the auto industry did cars the same way they did computers, you would be able to get a Jaguar for $400. lol

Maybe this is a chance for Heresy and Hasslefree to jump in and make some cash selling special bitz sprues.

 

[noneedforaname]

ok here is what i have been told regarding the thinking behind the bits revision.

They did a break down of how different parts sold, for example

if you bought a left rhinox side 99% of people bought all the other components.

therefore they packaged it inot one box.

one code, one stock item, less chance of packing errors thus simpler and more cost effective.

things like the stormboy bitz packs they did in fives because most people build up units in fives.

so therefore you get the same reasons above.

as the year goes on more bits packs will become available on the new website when it is launched around may.

as for individual parts they are looking at doing booster sprues rather than individual parts.

if you want swords, you can get a sprue of swords, if you want sm heads you can get a sprue of them and so on.

this is aimed at reducing the number of lines, improving stock control and cost cutting.

Also if there is no current equivalent in a range expect to see the classic model come back available, but if there is a current equivalent expect it the classic to disappear.

Also there will be lots more mail order only \"collectors\" model.

Oh and one last thing dark heresy and other role play/boardgames without a miniature content are going to be carried on being produced under licence by fantasy flight.

make of that what you will.

 

[Bengoodall]

Then why make a huge range of plastic bits, increasing the parts range, if you then do a U turn on that and start cutting it down again.

Oh no, wait, thats making sense again....

 

[Sand Rat]

Damnit Man - you\'re not drinking enough to see the GW logic - To the Freak Bar for 1500 CC\'s of Alcohol, STAT!!:beer: