A very close personal friend of mine and buisiness partner in this deal is really knowledgeable in Web design / site building and such so there will be a professional grade web site to go along with this. Forums would be a must have feature though so that is a definite inclusion.
What makes a miniature line successful?
- Thread starter SIGIL
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I totally agree on having a site but as Kev said it has to be a living site.And perhaps even more, if you don\'t produce a lot of minis when you begin.
For example (silly one) if you hav eonly three minis to show,show them one by week.Better than three the first week and people forget you the following ones.
And once again,sorry for my \"english\".
For example (silly one) if you hav eonly three minis to show,show them one by week.Better than three the first week and people forget you the following ones.
And once again,sorry for my \"english\".
Well the way I am going to try to work it is to put up a preview of two minis at first, then every week put up at least two more.. failing that at least two WIP\' s per week and six finished greens a month. But I am planning on holding out until I have at least six finished greens. Three of them, in progress at the moment, are representative of one of the Human factions ( there will be more than one ), the other three will represent the three other eh...NOT so human races. 
I figure that way I can give a prelude as to what people can expect at first from the line and still give myself at least a month\'s head start on the update schedule.
I figure that way I can give a prelude as to what people can expect at first from the line and still give myself at least a month\'s head start on the update schedule.
Just another observation:
It is likely that whatever you have in mind has probably been done by someone, sometime.
For example, your idea of a setting where metal weapons are rare somewhat resembles RuneQuest\'s Glorantha setting.
Don\'t be discouraged by this, though. Just because it\'s been done before doesn\'t mean you can\'t do it in a way that will fire peoples\' imaginations.
I personally am not too crazy about the wargame aspect. I don\'t want to paint a warband. I\'d also like to see minis that are useable for other settings than just yours. Versatility is key to a successful business, IMHO.
It is likely that whatever you have in mind has probably been done by someone, sometime.
For example, your idea of a setting where metal weapons are rare somewhat resembles RuneQuest\'s Glorantha setting.
Don\'t be discouraged by this, though. Just because it\'s been done before doesn\'t mean you can\'t do it in a way that will fire peoples\' imaginations.
I personally am not too crazy about the wargame aspect. I don\'t want to paint a warband. I\'d also like to see minis that are useable for other settings than just yours. Versatility is key to a successful business, IMHO.
In the capacity that some of the components have een done before yes.... But all the components together, I very seriously doubt it. Not trying to be uppity or conceited but I have really never seen anything similar to what I intend to do. ANd that is the dilemma... I do not know if it will be too foreign for players to get into.
Well I would love to see my minis put to use in other settings, but I am afraid that what I have in mind might not mesh well with existing games and lines...... Well to some extent. I am sure that a creative player / writer could come up with a way to make the cultural themes work with other more divergent culture themes...
And as far as versatility being the key to success for an independant miniature line, I agree whole heartedly. I have thought of doing some generic fantasy iconic characters, much as Reaper does, but I do not want my stuff to be JUST another face in the crowd. Know what I mean?
Yea, I agree with what people have said. I would just like to stress that if you make a quality product, people will buy it. A lot of unsuccessful companies got certain aspects right, but cheaped out on others. Make fantastic miniatures, have them well painted, make up a creative storyline (and fairly believable) and also have a good website. It seems you will work on these so I am just trying to encourage you. Good luck!!
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Good sculpts.....:duh:
A late response..
I may be slightly biased...and this comes hard to an Englishman speaking about a French company *swallow* but if you want to look at a real success story...look no further than Rackham. Their success has been meteoric. Exactly why this has been so is worthy of another thread.
If you don\'t believe me....compare the Confrontation threads with all the other games-related forum threads on this site.
I may be slightly biased...and this comes hard to an Englishman speaking about a French company *swallow* but if you want to look at a real success story...look no further than Rackham. Their success has been meteoric. Exactly why this has been so is worthy of another thread.
If you don\'t believe me....compare the Confrontation threads with all the other games-related forum threads on this site.
Oh yeah I totally agree that Rackham\'s success with Confrontation is the model ideal for any company trying to make it as a mini manufacturer... ANd what I meant that Warhammer and CCOnfrontation are virtually interchangeable is that neither one is REALLY that different thematically if you boil them down to brass tacks. Both operate on the same Tolkien-esque High fantasy formula that virtually EVERY fantasy IP or game operates on. Elves are beautiful and magical and come in three different flavors. Dwarves live in the hills and mountain caverns and tinker around with technology or dig holes for gold. Humans are the catch all in betweener race. Ogres and orcs are big stupid lugs with a mean streak a mile wide. Goblins are little green men with a chip on their shoulder that outweighs them by several 100 pounds. Knights ride brilliantly magnificent Horses and Wizards wear funny hats and carry books and scrolls everywhere they go.... Blah blah blah .... See where I am going with this?
I agree with you that COnfrontation by far is the best the prettiest face in the crowd and has a winning personality to boot, but I want to start a line that walks on stilts through the crowd.
And I meant that WOTC had terrible minis.... NOT Reaper. I very much respect the abilities of their sculptors...... I am not so fond of their designs but that is another matter entirely.
I have toyed around with the idea.... You will not be disappointed.
And thanks for the well wishing James9487.
I agree with you that COnfrontation by far is the best the prettiest face in the crowd and has a winning personality to boot, but I want to start a line that walks on stilts through the crowd.
And I meant that WOTC had terrible minis.... NOT Reaper. I very much respect the abilities of their sculptors...... I am not so fond of their designs but that is another matter entirely.
I have toyed around with the idea.... You will not be disappointed.
And thanks for the well wishing James9487.
well, I am a little late to add much new here I think, but I\'ll try anyway!
In my opinion, for a new game, people are attracted by outstanding minis, but they won\'t stay without outstanding game rules. Along with rules a comprehensive world fluff, enough to create a comfort with the system you\'re playing. Listening to gamers at play, it seems the conversation will tend to focus on 4 things:
1) Minis
2) Paint jobs (the one you can\'t provide for them)
3) Rules
4) Fluff
To keep people interested you\'ve got to give them the 3 you can at a high quality (and teasing them with high quality paint jobs as well). And I mean at a level which would make them decide to stop playing another game and play yours.
Good luck however, I look forward to seeing this idea develop!
In my opinion, for a new game, people are attracted by outstanding minis, but they won\'t stay without outstanding game rules. Along with rules a comprehensive world fluff, enough to create a comfort with the system you\'re playing. Listening to gamers at play, it seems the conversation will tend to focus on 4 things:
1) Minis
2) Paint jobs (the one you can\'t provide for them)
3) Rules
4) Fluff
To keep people interested you\'ve got to give them the 3 you can at a high quality (and teasing them with high quality paint jobs as well). And I mean at a level which would make them decide to stop playing another game and play yours.
Good luck however, I look forward to seeing this idea develop!
FredrickvonCarstein
New member
If any other races are needed I\'d be quite willing to lend a helping hand in the development. I couldn\'t make a soccer ball out of green stuff so no worries about me copying the designs.
kittykat23uk
New member
Well there are a several sides to my answer to this. Firstly what attracts me to a miniature line are:
1. As a painter, not a gamer, for me the company needs to produce nicely sculpted models of subjects I find interesting.
2. In my case I am attracted to Rackham because of their wolfen and devourer armies, though I also appreciate the superb paint jobs of the full range and occasionally buy some of the orc and dirz models.
3. I\'m attracted to Reaper because they do a very nice range of dragons, along with some other nice critters, similarly I was attracted to Ral Partha.
4. I buy GW models, originally because I liked the armies (lizardmen, tyranids) and some of their other models but now I have gone off GW a lot (they haven\'t really produced anything I\'ve found interesting since the carnosaur), but I still buy the occasional model to compete at Games Day (but I generally buy more Forgeworld stuff).
5. So basically, from a personal standpoint for me to buy any of your minis, I would like to see some critters of some sort, dragons, werecreatures (catgirls please!!) etc, but the latter on a similar scale to Rackham wolfen. Also you\'d need to strike the right balance if you are doing dragons so that they present something original to the market, but not so removed from the idea of what is a dragon to miss the mark completely. The Ral Partha dragon of the month series is an example of how not to do this!
6. What I believe makes a \"successful\" miniatures line is not just good minis, it is the support network that (e.g.) GW has built up with in-store game demos, magazine publications and a fan base built up over a number of years.
7. Most gamers that I have met do not seem to have an interest in buying enough minis from a different game system to be able to play a game because no one else is willing to buy a similar sized army.
8. I have tried to get people into confrontation, but there is little interest, despite people making good noises about the miniatures.
Personally I think it would be easier for you to create a successful miniature line that people can use for other games systems (not just wargames, but RPGs too) than to get buy-in to a completely new games system. Either way I wish you good luck and I\'d like to see some catgirls please!!
Kind regards
Kat
1. As a painter, not a gamer, for me the company needs to produce nicely sculpted models of subjects I find interesting.
2. In my case I am attracted to Rackham because of their wolfen and devourer armies, though I also appreciate the superb paint jobs of the full range and occasionally buy some of the orc and dirz models.
3. I\'m attracted to Reaper because they do a very nice range of dragons, along with some other nice critters, similarly I was attracted to Ral Partha.
4. I buy GW models, originally because I liked the armies (lizardmen, tyranids) and some of their other models but now I have gone off GW a lot (they haven\'t really produced anything I\'ve found interesting since the carnosaur), but I still buy the occasional model to compete at Games Day (but I generally buy more Forgeworld stuff).
5. So basically, from a personal standpoint for me to buy any of your minis, I would like to see some critters of some sort, dragons, werecreatures (catgirls please!!) etc, but the latter on a similar scale to Rackham wolfen. Also you\'d need to strike the right balance if you are doing dragons so that they present something original to the market, but not so removed from the idea of what is a dragon to miss the mark completely. The Ral Partha dragon of the month series is an example of how not to do this!
6. What I believe makes a \"successful\" miniatures line is not just good minis, it is the support network that (e.g.) GW has built up with in-store game demos, magazine publications and a fan base built up over a number of years.
7. Most gamers that I have met do not seem to have an interest in buying enough minis from a different game system to be able to play a game because no one else is willing to buy a similar sized army.
8. I have tried to get people into confrontation, but there is little interest, despite people making good noises about the miniatures.
Personally I think it would be easier for you to create a successful miniature line that people can use for other games systems (not just wargames, but RPGs too) than to get buy-in to a completely new games system. Either way I wish you good luck and I\'d like to see some catgirls please!!
Kind regards
Kat
there are a few things that will make a miniature range succesful.
1: Marketing. The most important factor, this includes kick ass paint jobs, look at Rackham, nobody would ever have even noticed them internationally with their first wave of minis if the paint jobs weren\'t totally out there. The casting was inferior, the sculpting 2 dimentional and rough.... You need to make sure everybody in the miniature world knows about you, spam every forum you can find, post to every news site, have a good site of your own, get distributors involved that are excited about your product.
2: Quality. when the hype dies down, you need to be able to come up with the goods. The market will only forgive clumsy beginner\'s jitters for so long, a year, year and a hlaf at most. Make sure you deliver your goods on time, that it is high quality and that will make the customers believe you have a reliable, decent product to sell.
3:Company Identity. the reason why GW and Rackham are so succesfull, is because they target the obsessive element in this market. don\'t feel offended, we all are, some less than others. By creating \'heroes\' out of the creative staff and random employees, GW mainly do this, you create a world to which your customers want to belong. this creates a myth of how the company works(bit like wonka\'s chocolate factory), and will also increase it\'s kudos.
3:IP. Intellectual Property is important if you want to grow beyond the smallish company size like Spyglass or aforementioned Hasslefree. This is not something you will need to begin with, don\'t forget that Rackham became popular when their game system was only available in Frnch. Having a game system can actually fence you in, because you will be judged on the quality of the illustrations and presentation of any material as well.
these are 4 points that are the core of a succesful business in the gaming industry really...
1: Marketing. The most important factor, this includes kick ass paint jobs, look at Rackham, nobody would ever have even noticed them internationally with their first wave of minis if the paint jobs weren\'t totally out there. The casting was inferior, the sculpting 2 dimentional and rough.... You need to make sure everybody in the miniature world knows about you, spam every forum you can find, post to every news site, have a good site of your own, get distributors involved that are excited about your product.
2: Quality. when the hype dies down, you need to be able to come up with the goods. The market will only forgive clumsy beginner\'s jitters for so long, a year, year and a hlaf at most. Make sure you deliver your goods on time, that it is high quality and that will make the customers believe you have a reliable, decent product to sell.
3:Company Identity. the reason why GW and Rackham are so succesfull, is because they target the obsessive element in this market. don\'t feel offended, we all are, some less than others. By creating \'heroes\' out of the creative staff and random employees, GW mainly do this, you create a world to which your customers want to belong. this creates a myth of how the company works(bit like wonka\'s chocolate factory), and will also increase it\'s kudos.
3:IP. Intellectual Property is important if you want to grow beyond the smallish company size like Spyglass or aforementioned Hasslefree. This is not something you will need to begin with, don\'t forget that Rackham became popular when their game system was only available in Frnch. Having a game system can actually fence you in, because you will be judged on the quality of the illustrations and presentation of any material as well.
these are 4 points that are the core of a succesful business in the gaming industry really...
I read you basicly want to do this alone. You can, but this can mean all your time is going to be swallowed by casting, packaging, dealing with orders, administration, PR, advertisements, etc. , etc. So keep in mind that you risk not having much time left for actual sculpting. I recently mailed with a sculptor who had started a company and he\'s not been able to do any sculpting for over a year now. All new figures he has are by others for that reason. So, when you start you may have to sculpt in advance so you have spare figures to release.
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Active member
Good sculpts. If your product is good enough, you shouldn\'t need anything flashy to start with. I\'m sure that if the minis were good enough, they\'d sell through the CMON shop.
Quality limited editions seem to affect the weak-willed especially......
You can worry about everything else once you have a product!!
Quality limited editions seem to affect the weak-willed especially......
You can worry about everything else once you have a product!!
Minigrrrl..... VERY well thought out reply... Your post suggests some shrewd buisness sense.
Thanks to everyone for their input on the subject, I hope that this thread will continue on a bit more as I think it has made for some interesting discussion thuis far. At this point I am still a bit up in the air. I would love to be able to do both an anti traditional fantasy line and a traditional fantasy but I doubt I could have enough time to do both well.
Ah well. Maybe I will post up some concept art to test the waters.... Anybody know anything about IP copyrights?
Thanks to everyone for their input on the subject, I hope that this thread will continue on a bit more as I think it has made for some interesting discussion thuis far. At this point I am still a bit up in the air. I would love to be able to do both an anti traditional fantasy line and a traditional fantasy but I doubt I could have enough time to do both well.
Ah well. Maybe I will post up some concept art to test the waters.... Anybody know anything about IP copyrights?
